Cowboy Matt Deas, one of the OG rockcrawlers hails from North Carolina where he raises kids and horses. Matt shares with us some great stories about rockcrawling in the early days.. Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.
5:16 – Man, I love my childhood going to school and stuff, there were 89 of us in my graduating
10:43 – Once I got healed, I started ordering parts and got me a trail rig
17:11 – from 02-03 the sport evolved more, more participants and stuff
22:07 – Jellico was always my favorite because that’s where it all started for me
29:44 – Probably the WE Rock in ’07 we ended up third, but I remember the level of competition was huge
38:56 – I want to say it was ’10 a lot of people were coming back, they caught their breath and was like, hey, we survived the storm
47:01 – I’m going to treat myself for a while, I’m going to treat myself for a while, I made it three weeks
57:44 – We ought to put a show on, get some sponsorship and really pump it up – you woulda been proud of me.
Special thanks to 4low Magazine and Maxxis Tires for support and sponsorship of this podcast.
Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.
Cowboy Matt Deas, one of the OG rockcrawlers hails from North Carolina where he raises kids and horses. Matt shares with us some great stories about rockcrawling in the early days.. Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.
5:16 – Man, I love my childhood going to school and stuff, there were 89 of us in my graduating
10:43 – Once I got healed, I started ordering parts and got me a trail rig
17:11 – from 02-03 the sport evolved more, more participants and stuff
22:07 – Jellico was always my favorite because that’s where it all started for me
29:44 – Probably the WE Rock in ’07 we ended up third, but I remember the level of competition was huge
38:56 – I want to say it was ’10 a lot of people were coming back, they caught their breath and was like, hey, we survived the storm
47:01 – I’m going to treat myself for a while, I’m going to treat myself for a while, I made it three weeks
57:44 – We ought to put a show on, get some sponsorship and really pump it up – you woulda been proud of me.
Special thanks to 4low Magazine and Maxxis Tires for support and sponsorship of this podcast.
Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.
[00:00:01.080]
Welcome to Conversations with Big Rich. This is an interview-style podcast. Those interviewed are all involved in the off-road industry. Being involved, like all of my guests are, is a lifestyle, not just a job. I talk to past, present, and future legends, as well as business owners, employees, media, and land use warriors, men and women who have found their way into this exciting and addictive lifestyle we call off-road. We discuss their personal history, struggles, successes, and reboots. We dive into what drives them to stay active and off-road. We all hope to shed some light on how to find a path into this world that we live and love and call off-road.
[00:00:45.280]
Whether you're crawling the Red Rocks of Moab or hauling your toys to the trail, Maxxis has the tires you can trust for performance and durability. Four wheels or two, Maxxis tires are the choice of champions because they know that whether for work or play, for fun or competition, Maxxis tires deliver. Choose Maxxis. Tread victoriously.
[00:01:13.030]
Have you seen 4Low magazine yet? 4Low magazine is a high-quality, well-written, four-wheel drive-focused magazine for the enthusiast market. If you still love the idea of a printed magazine, something to save and read at any time, 4LOW is the magazine for you.4Low cannot be found in stores, but you can have it delivered to your home or place of business. Visit 4LOWmagazine.Com to order your subscription today.
[00:01:39.610] - Big Rich Klein
On today's episode of Conversations, I get to interview Matt Deas, from Rock Crawler to Family Man to North Carolina Cowboy. Matt Deas, how are you doing today?
[00:01:51.380] - Matt Deas
I'm doing good, Rich. How are you doing?
[00:01:53.160] - Big Rich Klein
Doing excellent. Glad to get you on here.
[00:01:56.180] - Matt Deas
I'm glad you got... Glad to be on here. Yeah.
[00:01:59.250] - Big Rich Klein
Thanks for having It's going to be fun. Remind us about those old days because you're one of the O'G's, you know?
[00:02:04.590] - Matt Deas
Yeah.
[00:02:05.140] - Big Rich Klein
Even though you're in your 40s now?
[00:02:09.350] - Matt Deas
42, yeah. Be similar. I turned 42.
[00:02:11.750] - Big Rich Klein
You're still a kid. You know, that's when I started doing the Cal Rock events.
[00:02:16.810] - Matt Deas
Is that right? You're 42, huh?
[00:02:17.900] - Big Rich Klein
I was 42. Yeah.
[00:02:19.300] - Matt Deas
Wow.
[00:02:20.930] - Big Rich Klein
It's amazing.
[00:02:22.150] - Matt Deas
It's crazy how fast time goes. That's for sure.
[00:02:24.740] - Big Rich Klein
Absolutely. So let's find out more about you. And where were you born How did you get raised?
[00:02:31.280] - Matt Deas
I was born, actually, in Bradenton, Florida. We moved to Western North Carolina. I think I just turned two years old. So been here, I tell everybody I'm from here. I've been here 40 years anyway, or a little over 40. I don't even really remember. Besides going back and seeing family in Florida and stuff, I don't even really remember anything about it. Just this is home to me.
[00:02:55.480] - Big Rich Klein
Right. And what created the move? Did your parents move because of work or family? Yeah.
[00:03:02.790] - Matt Deas
Or was it- Work and family. I've got an older brother. Even back then, like crime and drugs and all that. In that part of Florida, we're starting to escalate and stuff. My mom and dad, they just elected. They didn't want to raise two kids in that environment or whatever. They moved here. Let's see, it'd be my dad's parents. They had a summer home up here. We come here on vacation a lot, and it's always just been a small, quiet town or whatever. Anyhow, that's what brought us here in North Carolina.
[00:03:40.960] - Big Rich Klein
How many people are in the town you're at now?
[00:03:44.480] - Matt Deas
Man, so now it's a pretty big town. As far as overpopulated, it turned into one of the most visited. Brightson City is actually one of the most visited destinations in the world right now. Tourism just absolutely took this place over. Numbers-wise, now, I have no idea. I mean, really back in the '80s and even early '90s and stuff, there was really not a lot of jobs. It was a poor area. And there's so many multimillionaires that's moved in here, especially after COVID. When COVID hit, everybody wanted out the cities and they wanted to move here or towns like this. And, man, it's just it's crazy the amount of people just to get through our little town. The town hasn't really changed the infrastructure of it. You can imagine it's like a… It's a Zoom, just trying to get through to the bank or the grocery store. It's not the little quiet town I grew up in, that's for sure.
[00:04:46.750] - Big Rich Klein
So is it artsy now? Is that what it is that's attracting the business?
[00:04:51.220] - Matt Deas
Outdoor. So people that are big into fishing, like fly fishing or whatever, we have some of the best fly fishing there he is. Trout fishing. Mountain biking is huge. Whitewater rafting. Of course, we have the casino now. It's just, yeah, a lot of it's outdoorsy type stuff. Okay.
[00:05:13.610] - Big Rich Klein
So what was it like going to school there?
[00:05:16.980] - Matt Deas
Man, I love my childhood going to school and stuff. I don't know, man. It was never really any issues growing up. I think I graduated. There was, I think there was 89 of us. Everybody knew everybody. To an extent, it's that way now. You go to a restaurant or something like that, you look around, you're like, Wow, I don't know really anybody in here. 15, 20 years ago, you knew everybody in the restaurant. But no, my childhood was great, man. School was great. What I'd give to go back.
[00:05:53.990] - Big Rich Klein
Did you play sports or anything like that?
[00:05:58.670] - Matt Deas
Yeah. Actually, I played baseball quite a bit in my younger years. Then my dad got me into go-car racing when I was around about six. I still continue to play baseball. And slowly, the racing took over, and And I quit playing baseball and didn't play any sports, really, until I got into high school and actually started playing football.
[00:06:22.540] - Big Rich Klein
What position did you play?
[00:06:25.600] - Matt Deas
Let's see. It was tailback and strong safety. Okay.
[00:06:27.960] - Big Rich Klein
Nice. Did you do any scouting or anything like that?
[00:06:32.470] - Matt Deas
No. I was good enough to start, but I was just an average football player, average athlete.
[00:06:41.830] - Big Rich Klein
And what about grade-wise in school? Were you a good student or were you one of those that was always looking to get out of the building?
[00:06:48.650] - Matt Deas
Hey, man, I was just good enough to get by. I guess it wasn't really that I struggled academically. I mean, the work didn't ever really seemed to be that difficult, but I always had my mind on, wow, man, I'd like to be at the shop, or I got a race coming up. I can't wait to get out of school so I can go get the carts and everything ready to go. I don't know. I guess I just didn't apply myself.
[00:07:13.100] - Big Rich Klein
Did you have technical classes? You know, metal shop, wood shop, those things?
[00:07:18.170] - Matt Deas
No. You know what's crazy, man, is I didn't even take auto mechanics or anything in school. I just got through, just done the normal classes or whatnot. A lot of people would always give me a hard time because my dad owned a body shop for 47 and a half years. When I got out of high school, that's what I started doing. I did get my welding degree. I went on and got certified in welding doing night classes once I graduated. But I didn't want to sound like I knew everything, but it was just the stuff they were learning. I don't know. I had already been through all that and been around them my whole life, so it just felt like it was a waste of time.
[00:07:59.280] - Big Rich Klein
Right. Okay. Those years, your dad owned the body shop, so I would imagine you're around cars all the time and stuff. Did you guys get outdoors? Did you go camping, wheeling, anything like that as a family?
[00:08:16.460] - Matt Deas
No, I really didn't get into off roading until shortly after I graduated high school. A lot of what my dad and I did growing up is spend a lot of time together at the shop after school School and stuff, getting go-carts ready. I raced go-carts from the time I was 6 till, I guess I was about 16, whenever I quit messing with it or whatever, mainly just because football and stuff was taking a lot of time and whatnot. They want you in the weight room a lot. They want you doing this all the time, different camps. I just didn't have the time to put into it to be successful. Started playing football, but no, we I'd never do a whole lot of that stuff.
[00:09:03.190] - Big Rich Klein
How did you get into off-roading then?
[00:09:09.120] - Matt Deas
I'd always was intrigued by it and thought it was neat. My junior year, I was… Actually, it sounds like I'm bragging, but I was pretty good at snowboarding. My mom was going to Colorado. We were going to Breckenridge. I was going to be there for a month. My My mom was going out to train some people on some computer stuff at this resort. My brother actually partied with this guy, Hank College, that later went on and got in with ride snowboards. I was going to be out there for a month, and I was going to meet up with that guy, potentially get a sponsorship with ride snowboards. That was my junior year. I was going to be there a month. The first run, I ended up breaking two vertebrate in my back. Oh, jeez. I laid in the hospital for, I think it's four or five days. Obviously, that ended the chance of getting sponsored or whatever. Ended up coming back home. I had to stay in a brace for, I think it was eight weeks or something like that, like one of those halo braces or whatnot. I never was able to pursue that dream or whatever.
[00:10:28.030] - Matt Deas
I continued snowboarding, but just wasn't able to go at it like I did before.
[00:10:33.620] - Big Rich Klein
Then the offroading, just to shoot an offshoot of hanging out with friends that had four-wheel drivers, to buy a Jeep?
[00:10:43.670] - Matt Deas
Yeah. The continuation of that story is like, my brother was his roommate in college or whatever, had a CJ5. College kids always being broke or whatever. The roommate went to my dad and said, Would you be interested in buying this CJ5? I'm really needing the money. He bought it just before this happened, before I broke my back. Anyway, he buys it. I told him, I guess he was feeling bad for me being in the hospital. I told him, I said, I'd really like to build that Jeep. But the conversation before I got hurt was I didn't really buy it to keep it. I bought it to sell it and make money on it. Anyway, he ended up giving me the Jeep and come home. Once I got healed up a month or two later, started ordering some parts and this, that, and the other, and it It was just like a, I don't know, we put a nine-inch in the rear and a Dana 44 in the front, 3811 boggers. I was like, Yeah, man, got me a trail rig. Man, that thing, that's where it all began. It just snowballed from there.
[00:11:44.540] - Big Rich Klein
Was there a club involved? Did you get involved in the club or just hanging out with friends? Or how did you find people to wheel with?
[00:11:52.050] - Matt Deas
This is funny, too. My brother-in-law now didn't know he was going to be my brother-in-law then. He had went over to... Years ago, I'm sure you've heard of it, Teleco Off-Road Park in Murphy, North Carolina. That was just such a huge place. I've been over there with him a time or two. He had an old Ford Bronco, and that's when I was like, Man, I really want to start getting into this. Anyhow, ended up getting the Jeep built and met some folks over there. Of course, my brother-in-law now and a few of his friends, which later become a really good friend of mine and actually was my spotter for many But we just started going over there. A lot of times through the weekend or whatever, we'd go camp and spend a Friday, Saturday, or Sunday over there and just wear it out.
[00:12:43.520] - Big Rich Klein
Then you came across guys like Durham and stuff and Shoupie?
[00:12:48.810] - Matt Deas
No, I didn't really meet those guys. Let's see, that was probably in '99. I think I went to an E-Rock event in '02, if that sounds right. Mike Wike, which was my spotter, became my spotter, but we'd trail wheeled or whatever all the time. He said, Man, they're having a competition in Jellico, Tennessee. We ought to go watch. So we went, and I just instantly fell in love with it. I told him, I said, Next year, we're going to do this. That's when I'd met seeing Shupy and Durham and some of those guys that had been at it since day one. Later, that winter, I actually took my CJ5 and ended up cutting it and back half and doing all two work and whatnot. I put coalovers on it and upgraded a lot of stuff, and we went back in '03 Dury, which was really a huge learning curve for us. It was a huge accomplishment if we just finished the event without tearing it all to pieces.
[00:13:56.710] - Big Rich Klein
I think that was the case with a lot of guys back then.
[00:14:02.020] - Matt Deas
It was so much to learn, which I was just a kid. I look back now, I think I was 20, I think, 21 when I started doing it. I don't know, I was just a kid and just had this big dream. So, yeah, that's what started. It started in '03.
[00:14:20.430] - Big Rich Klein
So a question. The buddy that you went to Jellico with, you said that he ended up being your brother-in-law. So obviously, Kim was a little sister?
[00:14:32.160] - Matt Deas
So no, he married the older sisters. Oh, okay. Yeah, Kim's the middle. So back to my football days, Tommy, which is my brother-in-law, was my football coach. Then we went to practice or whatever. We'd get talking. He told me he had an old Bronco, and he loved going over to Telecom. We ought to go sometime. Of course, I always had a crush on Kim back in high school, but she was older. She It doesn't have nothing to do with me or whatever. But yeah, it's just funny how life works out later ends up being- So you scored the older girl? Correct. Oh, yeah.
[00:15:09.360] - Big Rich Klein
Oh, man.
[00:15:11.040] - Matt Deas
I give her a hard time still this day. I'm like, whenever I would like. Because her younger sister and I were the same grade. We were always really good friends or whatever, and I'd always be like, Let's get with your sister. She would never have anything to do with me.
[00:15:27.280] - Big Rich Klein
So let's explore that. How How did you get her to get interest in you?
[00:15:34.230] - Matt Deas
Man, it was... God, what was I? We've been together 20 years. I'm 42, so I just turned 22 at a bar. At a bar drinking Her sister actually come and pick me up from another party because I had too much to drink. She's like, Come down to the bar. Everybody's down here. I was like, No way I can make it. She's like, Well, we'll send somebody to get you. They come and pick me up and go to the bar. She was in there and she was like, dancing. I'm not really a dancer, so that tells you how much I had to drink. I thought it was a good idea to go dance. I was out there dancing with her and, I don't know, just talking shit, I guess. Finally, talked to her in the light, giving me a chance. She tells everybody, said, Yeah, he never went home after that.
[00:16:18.960] - Big Rich Klein
So you had too much to drink. You were dancing, drunk, and you put the moves on, and it worked.
[00:16:29.290] - Matt Deas
It worked. It was a success. Twenty years later, man. Twenty years later, two kids.
[00:16:34.550] - Big Rich Klein
You must be a good drunk. Or at least that night.
[00:16:42.780] - Matt Deas
That night, anyway. Yeah, that night. It must have been impactful.
[00:16:48.030] - Big Rich Klein
It wasn't a pity date then.
[00:16:51.490] - Matt Deas
No, no, definitely not.
[00:16:53.610] - Big Rich Klein
So then let's get back to the rock crawling then. So early days, Jellico, what was that very first event? What did you think that very first event when you got there and you see everybody and you're registering? What was it all like?
[00:17:11.330] - Matt Deas
Man, because really, from '02 to '03, the sport even evolved more, more participants and stuff. I was just taking it all in. I was just a kid, and I was just happy to be there. The true competitive edge didn't come until you have one of those events where you end up doing pretty good and you're like, Man, I can compete with these guys. It didn't come that year. In '03, it didn't come that year at all. It was just, again, trying to focus on Trying to keep the rig together for one, and working on a budget. Then you start learning. Then every three seconds, you had to make forward progress or if it was a point, and trying to keep track of your clock. There was so much that we were just learning. That's all we were trying to do. I had no expectation whatsoever.
[00:18:07.560] - Big Rich Klein
What was the most memorable thing that happened from that first event? Do you remember? Is there anything that sticks out?
[00:18:15.220] - Matt Deas
There was a course that a lot of people were 40 and rolling on this and that and the other. Somehow, man, we ended up completing the course with a 20 or something like that. I I remember at the end of the course being like, Oh, my God. Seriously, it was maybe 10 people that finished the course. I remember being like, I think we're starting to get it. There was a little bit of light, a little glimmer of hope that we might be able to do this one day. But that was… Like I said, we had so much breakage and stuff tore up. It was just a miracle to finish a course. Right.
[00:18:56.100] - Big Rich Klein
So out of those days of competing, who would you say became your closest friend, but was also a competitor?
[00:19:04.290] - Matt Deas
In the early days or as time went on?
[00:19:07.340] - Big Rich Klein
Let's say the early days to begin with.
[00:19:11.120] - Matt Deas
Chris Durham always really got along with Chup. But Chris always took a lot more time. Chris isn't really a guy of many words. He sticks to himself. For whatever reason, and still to this day, he's one of the very few that I still keep in touch with. He would help me along, give me some pointers and advice. Like I say, this many years later, he and I, we don't talk as much as I'd like to, especially as close as we live. But I do still keep in touch with him. I haven't talked to Shupi in… God, man, it's been 12, 15 years. Buddy Carleton, I haven't talked to him in quite some time, and nothing bad ever happened. It's just life. But for whatever reason, Chris and I, we still keep in touch. To me, he was so talented, smart guy. Just a solid dude. And a solid dude. That's right. Exactly.
[00:20:10.190] - Big Rich Klein
I know you're pretty good friends with Jesse Haynes. How did that all come about?
[00:20:19.280] - Matt Deas
I'm trying to think. I believe I met him in '05. I think it was '05 that I met him at an event. Then in '06, I ended up buying a car from Brian Hamilton that was the Badlands had built, and it was the single-seater front engine that you straddled the transmission I remember when I sat on top of it or whatever. Then later, in '06, the start of the weather in the winter of '05, '06, I called Troy Myers and said, Hey, I got a vision of something that I like to build and didn't know if you guys would be interested. They were interested, and Jesse ended up building. That's really when he and I, his friendship really took off because he was really, to me, he was a masterpiece, what he built. It was like everything I had in my mind, he did it, but excelled, even took it up another notch. I would call him a lot, advice on how to maybe do something or build something or whatever, because when we got the car back, it was just a roller. The car looked so good. I was like, Man, I really don't want to go.
[00:21:38.000] - Matt Deas
I don't want to get this thing done. Everybody be like, Well, I can see where Jessie ended, and that began. I wanted it to flow. I wanted it to flow, and I wanted it to be a nice-looking car. I would call him a lot and pick his brain or whatnot. That's really when our friendship really took off.
[00:21:55.690] - Big Rich Klein
That's pretty cool. Excellent. Yes. In all those years of the crawling, what's your most favorite event site?
[00:22:07.690] - Matt Deas
Event site? Oh, man. That's a tough one. I loved them all for so many different reasons. I'm going to give you two. I know that wasn't a question, but I'm going to give you two. That's fine. So Jellico, to me, was always my favorite just because that's where it all started for me. First event I ever was, first event I ever peed at was at Jellico. It felt like home. But I don't know. I really loved the Columbus, Ohio, manmade course.
[00:22:49.720] - Big Rich Klein
Oh, man, the concrete jungle.
[00:22:51.790] - Matt Deas
Dude, that place was just amazing. It was. Even the one in Portland, Indiana, it was really neat, but I felt like the one in Ohio was just amazing. It was three or four times as big. I don't know. It was pretty wild.
[00:23:13.870] - Big Rich Klein
It's amazing that they ended up having to tear all that down. The guy, Guy Wolfemberger, that owned that property filled in wetlands to be able to have that site, built and then had us come out and take a look at it, right? And Little Rich and I go out there and we're looking at it, and I'm like, Wow, you should have called us before you built it. And he's like, Why? And I said, Because what you got here looks really cool, but there's nothing here that's usable. And he goes, What do you mean? And I said, You can't get cars onto it. There was no... I mean, it was just like a big six foot, eight foot tube. You And there was in this tube stacks and everything else, but there was no way to get on or around them. I mean, it was just... They needed to use that as the material to build, but no... So we started making recommendations, and he goes, I'm a multimillionaire, and I've done all this stuff in my life, and I'm not going to listen to no 20 something year old kid tell me how to build things.
[00:24:26.860] - Big Rich Klein
And I'm like, Well, you're a golfer, right? And he goes, Yeah. And I go, Well, you had the money to build Augusta National, and instead, you just built a pitch and put. And I said, So you better listen to that kid and let's do some work on this. Otherwise, we're not going to bring an event here because there's nothing we can do on it.
[00:24:55.390] - Matt Deas
Spectator-wise, it wasn't very friendly at all. That That was definitely a downfall on it. But as far as the driver and the way it was, the courses and stuff and the traction and the different obstacles, it was fun. It was fun to be on. But yeah, I can see as a promoter or like I said, a spectator. I remember my wife was like, I can't see shit. I can't see anything. I don't know what to tell you.
[00:25:23.620] - Big Rich Klein
When we first went there, we ended up having a lot of work done until we did the first event to make it so that it was usable. I mean, literally, you couldn't get onto the tubes. It was just the way they had put it together. But that's typical. Somebody that doesn't know anything about crawling, trying to build a crawling park. It's be like, I don't know, me going out and building a skyscraper. I wouldn't definitely go into it. So then, where was your first win?
[00:26:06.550] - Matt Deas
Oh, let me think. Yeah, 2005. It was actually the first event of 2005. I think it was a U-Rock event. 2005 at Jellico. That was actually when Marty Hart made his first appearance. Okay. Yeah, it was in '05. I remember it was April. It was in the April. We got there on Friday, and the weather was awesome. It was like '70s and sunny. By Sunday, it was flurting snow. Anyway, I had bought that car from Brian Hamilton. It still needs to be finished, wide, plumbed, painted, and interior done. Again, I was just a kid. I ended up, I bought it from him, and I spent a bunch of money I didn't really have. I remember telling my spotter, and I told my wife at the time, we were just dating. I told her, I was like, It's your either make me or break me. If I can do good, I'll keep doing it. If I can, I'm going to have to get out because I just spent a lot of money. I really didn't have. I went to that first event and I was like, This is it. I got to do good and stay really focused or whatever.
[00:27:23.590] - Matt Deas
At the end of the first day, I think we were beating Marty by 30 points. And ended up coming down. I made a mess out of a course on Sunday, and he closed the gap, and we were within a couple of points of each other. And I ended up beating him. I think it was about one or two points, and it was huge. But Marty felt like he had won. He felt like he got done wrong on another course, and we got into it at the awards, and I think later had respect for each other, but our friendship didn't really start off too good.
[00:27:54.330] - Big Rich Klein
Right. Welcome to crawling.
[00:27:57.530] - Matt Deas
Right. I tell you, Marty was a- Fierce competitor. He was a competitor. That's exactly right. He was a guy that made you drive harder, made you work harder, made you be more mentally prepared, everything, because I promise you he was going to be ready. I never felt like we were really good friends, but I think we both respect each other. I know I respected him as a competitor.
[00:28:23.350] - Big Rich Klein
What would you say was your most memorable event? Not the one you won, but something, an event that was just larger in life for you.
[00:28:39.770] - Matt Deas
Man, that's a tough one. I had so many great experiences in rock crawling. I mean, life experiences I think about all the time, really. It's been a long time ago. But in '05, we won the Championship and was able to get a little traction on some sponsorship. And finally, it was to the point where I felt like I could breathe and it wasn't just all coming out of my pocket. That was big. When it was in Portland, Indiana, we'd It was in Portland, Indiana. We'd won, and it come down to me and Marty again. And I had to beat him by two positions because I think he was ahead. He was ahead by two points or something in the series, and I ended up beating him. He hit a cone or something in the shootout, and I ended up ace in the shootout, if I remember correctly. I ended up ace in the shootout, if I remember correctly. I won, no. I ended up second. He ended up fourth. So I ended up winning the championship, winning the points. And that was something that was big. I took away from him and was super proud.
[00:29:44.710] - Matt Deas
But probably the We Rock in '07 in spring, Texas. We ended up third, but I remember the level of competition was huge. That was Shannon Campbell, Jesse, Tracy Jordan was there, Jason Poly was there. I'm sure I'm missing him. What was the Bruce guy?
[00:30:09.900] - Big Rich Klein
Zeller?
[00:30:10.930] - Matt Deas
Yeah, he was there. Yeah, there you go. That's him. There was just a lot of big names there and a lot of competition. I fished third, and I was proud of that, super proud. We were actually in the lead for a good bit, and I was on my next to last course. The car, I went to dig and let off the break, and the car was in such a bind, so much pressure. Actually, when I left the break, it pushed the car back into the cone and barely touched it. We went from first to like, sixth or fifth or something like that, and ended up coming in the shootout and made up a couple of plays. I was going to end up third. It was a really memorable event for me for some reason. Again, I think it was just all the big names and the level of competition.
[00:30:59.140] - Big Rich Klein
I think that It was one of those heyday events where it was before the economy took a dump and people started leaving the sport. The turnouts were really good at that time. Yeah.
[00:31:16.680] - Matt Deas
Yeah, for sure. Then there was a lot of great events in '06. We were running your series, and we were running New Rock. What was the one in Pennsylvania? New New Rock?
[00:31:30.410] - Big Rich Klein
New Rock, yeah.
[00:31:31.490] - Matt Deas
Yeah, we were running all three. There was a lot of great events. But for whatever reason, I think it was the first Championship win. For whatever reason, the We Rock in '07, that was big for me. Awesome.
[00:31:47.570] - Big Rich Klein
What was your absolutely worst nightmare experience event? I know there's got to be one that comes to my mind that happened to you.
[00:31:59.300] - Matt Deas
Oh, yeah. There was a lot. Yeah, anybody that did it long enough, they had to have one or two or five or whatever.
[00:32:09.110] - Big Rich Klein
I'm going to throw in, I'm going to throw in, Missouri.
[00:32:12.590] - Matt Deas
Yes, Missouri was always a disaster. Yes. It's between that or when we went to Tyler, Texas. It was just like, what could go wrong went wrong. But I got to say, Missouri in '08, the start of '08. I don't know. I think it was just a whole snowball effect, the fact that the economy was starting to tank. Diesel fuel was up to 4.29 a gallon. Sponsors were starting to say, Hey, we're not going to be able to give what we talked about. I treated it like a budget, like a business. I ran a budget at the beginning of the season and really tried to stick by that. I was a kid. I made good money. I did as straight out of school, and I worked at the shop. I made really good money. But For a 20-something-year-old kid to be doing it on that level, it's out of touch with reality when you're competing against grown men that have successful businesses. It also drove me to do good and put probably a lot of pressure on myself that wasn't really fair. But at the same time, also the reality was, if I don't win, we don't continue to do this.
[00:33:25.230] - Matt Deas
I've got to win that money. That's the only way we can keep coming back. I I loved it, and I still love it. I would give it anything to be able to rewind time and do it again. But it was probably the end. I spent a bunch of money, and midway through the winter, I get some calls from sponsors, and they say, Hey, this is only what we can do. We go and first event, our first obstacle will pull up. Caller is sideling in the bind or whatever. I elected just to front burn it really quick. When I did, it didn't exactly shoot and go down the heel. It went forward and then shot and did a big cartwheel roll and broke a ring in the motor power steering pump, the mainshaft and the power steering pump broke. It was just a disaster. I just told my wife, I was like, My heart's just not in it. I felt discouraged, I guess, because of everything that was going on. I knew what it cost just to go out there and back in diesel fuel and then your motel, and you're like, I got to win or I don't come out.
[00:34:33.460] - Matt Deas
If I don't win, it's either first or nothing. And first obstacle, you pull up, you have all that. And as much as it broke my heart and I didn't want to do it, I knew it was probably my best interest just to step out because I felt like maybe that's where the sport was going to go. Because of a lot of the chatter, people calling me, I'm being like, Man, I don't know if I can afford to do this. I was here, I was with two and enclosed trailer and all this stuff. I said, Man, I'm not going to be able to get something out of this. I sold out. I think it was the right decision at the time, but it wasn't an easy decision.
[00:35:14.040] - Big Rich Klein
During that event, or leading up to that event on the way there, you had somebody side swiped your trailer and stuff or something?
[00:35:25.650] - Matt Deas
Oh, shit. I forgot. Yeah, you're right. I forgot about that.
[00:35:27.640] - Big Rich Klein
I just remember you getting there, and it was just It was just a terrible shit show for you. Totally all out of your control.
[00:35:36.580] - Matt Deas
Dude, no, you're exactly right. I forgot about that. Maybe I tried to put it out of my mind. No, you're right. So a good friend of mine that helped me in the shop a lot. He's from North Carolina, but he lives downstairs, probably three hours from me. But he was going to college here at Western, which is really close. Anyway, he loved off roading. I would imagine he still falls with He would come to my shop a lot. Instead of staying up there at college or whatever, he'd come there and help me with the buggy a lot. Anyhow, he was like, Hey, we're going to Missouri. He said, Do you care if I go? I hope you drive. I said, No, I don't mind a bit. I bought a Hallmark Edge. It was like a 28-foot bumper pool. Nice trailer. We traveled. We were probably Nashville, I guess, somewhere in there. They on the road about 6 hours. I Man, I'm going to pull over and get some fuel. So I get fuel. We get back in the truck. He said, You want me to drive? I was like, Man, I'm not really sleepy, but we still got a ways to go.
[00:36:39.510] - Matt Deas
Yeah, if you want to drive, that's fine. We're getting on the on-ramp, and he's like, I'm talking. He's like, Why's your truck shaking? I was like, I don't know. Give it a little more fuel. I think maybe it'll... I don't know. I'm half paying attention what he's talking about. All of a sudden, the truck and trailer starts going back and forth, back and forth. I'm Stay with it, stay with it, stay with it. We got it slowed down to 35 and ended up jackknife. What happened was the car somehow coming strapped in the trailer.
[00:37:11.930] - Big Rich Klein
Oh, jeez.
[00:37:13.830] - Matt Deas
It rolled The weight went to the back of the trailer. The buggy went... You're accelerating, so the buggy's probably like, creeping back to the back, picking up on the back of the truck. So anybody that's pulled the trailer, you know what happens. What is weird, though, I'm assuming that's what happened because one of the trailer tires blew, and it wasn't the side that we hit the guardrail. It was on the other side because it just delaminated. I don't know if the tire blew right and got it going crazy like that. But the way the truck was acting and it was swerving back and forth, it was almost like the buggy had come unstrapped. Because when I opened the door, it was unstrapped. But again, it could have been the impact. But anyway, yeah, truck ends up jackknife. Trailer is up on the guardrail. There we are, 2:00, 3:00 in the morning on the side of the road, just trying to get it off the guardrail. God, I forgot about that. Good memory.
[00:38:15.420] - Big Rich Klein
I wasn't sure what happened then at that event when you showed up. I just remember that you were not in a good mood at that point before you started.
[00:38:26.260] - Matt Deas
It was hard to get my mind back in it. You're exactly right. Then The first obstacle, we pulled up and that happens, and the motors not run around, power stream pump. I was just like, Man, I can't. I don't have it in me. I just pulled it in the trailer, went back to the motel, took a shower, went to bed, got up next morning, and I didn't even pull in the events. I didn't attempt to fix it, nothing. Just come on home.
[00:38:50.710] - Big Rich Klein
Then, how much longer did you compete after that?
[00:38:56.490] - Matt Deas
I sold out. I never run another event. I think I took that season off. Man, I don't know Big Rich if it was '09 or '10. I want to say it was '10. A lot of people were coming back. They caught their breath and was like, Hey, we survived the storm. We made it through. I think we're going to try to compete. So I decided to build another buggy and ended up... You remember Rich and Ryan from Michigan?
[00:39:33.410] - Big Rich Klein
Yes.
[00:39:34.550] - Matt Deas
They built the chassis. It was a two-seat. It looked a lot like Jason Polley's the way he had done his stuff. It was a similar car like that and put a LS in it. I had a nine-inch front and rear, 60 outer stuff. Anyway, it was a super cool car, nice clean car. Then I went back and ran. I think I just went to Dayton, Tennessee, three or four times, and 10, three times. Did you guys go there three times that year?
[00:40:08.460] - Big Rich Klein
Twice.
[00:40:09.650] - Matt Deas
Twice, okay. I went there twice. And then, I think The start of '11, did you guys start the season there in '11?
[00:40:18.600] - Big Rich Klein
I don't know if we started the season there, but yeah, we were... Yeah, I don't remember the- Were you back there in '11? Did My memory's bad.
[00:40:32.210] - Matt Deas
Mine is, too. Anyway, I remember whenever I built it, I was like, Man, I don't really want a lot of sponsorship. I don't really want any because I don't want to feel obligated to be at certain events. So anyway, I didn't really ask for anything or call anybody, just build it or whatever. I ran it two or three times that year, however many times, twice, I guess. I want to say the next year in the spring, I ran it one more time, and a guy out of Texas called me and said, I want to buy your buggy. I was like, Because I remember saying, The season just started. If you want, call me back. In October, and I will entertain the idea of selling it. He was pretty adamant, and he said, Price it. So I priced it. Back then, he said, Give me your bank account number, and I'll transfer the funds. I was like, Okay. I give him my number and thinking, Yeah, right. I leave work at lunchtime. I go to town, I run the bank, and I went by. Sure enough, he had made the deposit. I was like, Oh, damn.
[00:41:43.250] - Matt Deas
A week later, he picked it up, and I never built another one. Never even sat in the seat of another one until 2015 when Jesse did his- Super crawl. Super crawl, yeah. It had been four or five years since I'd sat in the seat of one.
[00:42:03.410] - Big Rich Klein
What was it like getting back into it? Then you were driving Jesse's rigged then, wasn't it?
[00:42:12.720] - Matt Deas
Yeah. That's when he did the voting poll and stuff. A lot of people were like, You think you can still do it? I'm like, I think. I mean, I guess. Hell, I don't know. I went to tech that evening or whatever, and I got in the car and I took a piece of tape, some tape and a Sharpie, some white tape and a Sharpie, and labeled a couple of things just for myself to familiarize. That way, if I look down and make sure, Okay, that one's for front dig, or that's rear locker disengaged, this, that, and the other. It come back to me so fast. I was actually shocked at how quick it come back to me. The first obstacle, I was super nervous. I was like, Man, I really don't know. It's been five years. I I don't know if I can do this. But I would even get her to say, Now, I feel like if I were to get in a car that was relatively competitive, I feel like I would still be competitive. Maybe not. I don't know.
[00:43:11.220] - Big Rich Klein
Interesting. Okay. What did you do in that meantime? I mean, you were working at the body shop at that time, your dad's Body Shop?
[00:43:19.900] - Matt Deas
Yeah. You're talking about after I sold my last car?
[00:43:25.090] - Big Rich Klein
Well, during that time. Let's go back to work history before when you were When you were really young and you just got into it, you were working at the Body Shop?
[00:43:33.870] - Matt Deas
Yeah, sure was. Working for my dad straight out of high school. Like I said, I went night classes in college for two and a half years, but I was still working on my buggy or whatnot. That was really, man, I breathe. Each sleep, I'm breathing it. As soon as I get off work, man, I would stay out there and work on that thing until 2:00 or 3:00 in the morning, go to bed, get up at 7:00 again, go back to work at 8:00. I would do it for months, but I was just that eager and that driven by it. I loved it. It was just all I really thought about.
[00:44:16.440] - Big Rich Klein
Then you're working at the Body Shop. Did you continue that? How long did you work for your dad?
[00:44:23.410] - Matt Deas
Or do you still- No, we sold the business. As time went on, I don't I didn't really know how old I was or how long I'd been there, but become a partner as I got more invested and got older. My dad, he was about to be 62. Man, we were both We were both burned out. I mean, really, I'd been there for 22 and a half years, and he had been there for 47 and a half or whatever it was. The industry had really changed. No insurance company that had really started getting more and more control on the industry, and they control what you made. It was just getting to be a lot of frustration in dealing with the public. People aren't what they used to be. They're just not. People suck nowadays compared to what they were 15, 20 years ago. It's just the world we live in. Anyhow, he was ready to retire, and I was not wanting to continue. I was just done. I was burned out. Nothing ever felt like a challenge. It was just a job. He come to me one day and he said, What's your plan? What do you want to do?
[00:45:43.230] - Matt Deas
I said, Dad, I'm going to be honest with you. The only reason I'm here is for you. If you want to walk away right now, I'm good. He said, I need to be here two more years. I said, Okay. I said, I'll stay here with you. But in two years, I'd had a lot of opportunities to do other things and good opportunities. I didn't take them just because my dad... Excuse me. He's always been like my best friend. I told him, I said, I'll stay here as long as you do, but when you're done, I'm done. Sure enough, two years later, that day came, and he was ready to quit, and I was, too. It's crazy. We were in the process of... We finished up our last few jobs, and we were sorting through, and a guy comes up and said, I heard you guys were closing up. We're like, Yeah. He said, I'm interested in buying the place. I was like, Oh, even better. We ended up selling him the place with the majority of the equipment, our personal hand tools and some of the stuff. We actually I took to my shop here at my house or whatever.
[00:47:01.890] - Matt Deas
But yeah, it worked out great, man. It couldn't ask for better timing. We ended up selling him. I actually did an owner finance deal for five years. I think he's got another year and a half, and the blue in payment comes. But in the meantime, he's making a monthly payment. Everything's been good. I wasn't going to do anything for a while. I've been working since I was 16 years old, and If I wasn't playing football, then I was at the shop. I've just been around it since I was a kid, too. He's my five, six, seven, eight-year-old. That's where I spent my summers. I didn't spend them at the pool. I didn't spend them at summer camp. I spent them at the shop. Anyway, I said, I'm going to treat myself for a while. I don't know how long it'll last, but I'm not going to do nothing. I'm not going to do what I want to do. I made it three weeks. Three weeks? Yeah, and I was absolutely bored out of my mind. First week was pretty cool. Second week wasn't bad. The third week, I was like, Oh, my God, I can't do this.
[00:48:04.190] - Matt Deas
So Kim and I, we'd bought an extension, some property that joined us to our farm. It was also farmland, and we had to buy the house that went with the land in order to buy. They wouldn't separate it. So what's funny how things work is, one of my best friends was working for this guy, building houses. He said, Hey, he's younger, and just went out on his own. He said, Hey, His name's Dallas. He said, Dallas is looking for a house. You might want to show him that one. I said, Yeah, man, we're going to have to sell this thing. I didn't really want to have to buy the house, but we did. He ends up buying the house. We kept the land, and we were sitting around burning some brush one night and drinking beer, and he said, So what are you going to do now? I was like, I don't know, man. I haven't really thought much about it. I said, I'm not going to do anything for a month or so, but maybe one day or whatever, I'll get into something. He He said, Well, if you ever need a job, you can come work with me.
[00:49:02.580] - Matt Deas
I was like, Okay. Well, three weeks into my retirement, I took the kids to school, come back home. I was drinking coffee, watching TV, watching the news. I looked at the clock, it was 10:30 in the morning. I hadn't done shit. I was like, Oh, boy, this is not for me. I'm not this guy. I got to get back to work. I called him, I said, Man, you still need help? He was like, Yeah. Like yesterday. I was like, Sweet. When you want me to start? He said, How about Monday? I said, That works. Started building houses with him a little over three years ago. It was one of the best moves I've ever made. I absolutely love it. I mean, it's one of the best things I've ever done for myself.
[00:49:48.330] - Big Rich Klein
You're actually out there pounding nails?
[00:49:50.820] - Matt Deas
Yeah. We do everything. We do it all. He's a super talented guy. I've learned a lot from him. My My father-in-law, Kim and I, we got together. We had been together maybe a year, and we built a house together. Me and her and her dad, my dad and my uncle, we built our first house. It was a big, nice house. I learned a lot as a kid, 23, 24, whatever I was. In the meantime, of course, we later, he and I built a shop at that house and then built a barn. I always liked it. It always I don't know. It interests me. I think the fact that you could get so much satisfaction in an eight-hour day. You could look back in eight hours and be like, damn, we got a lot done in eight hours. It was rewarding. I always had a love for it. It interests me a lot. Whenever I went, I wasn't completely blind to it. I knew a little bit about it, but man, in three years, I've caught on quick and I've learned a lot. I think in one year, me, him, and another guy, we built eight houses in a year.
[00:51:06.000] - Matt Deas
Wow, very good. Yeah, we're building a house right now. It's only a million dollar guest house, and it's got a 200-year-old timber frame inside of it. The timber frame came from Wisconsin. 1839 is when it was built. This guy bought the old barn and had it tore down and shipped here. We actually assembled the timber frame first and then built the house around it.
[00:51:33.900] - Big Rich Klein
That sounds pretty sweet.
[00:51:36.540] - Matt Deas
Yeah, it's something to see. It's pretty incredible.
[00:51:41.810] - Big Rich Klein
So let's talk about Matt Dees, the cowboy.
[00:51:51.560] - Matt Deas
Yeah, man.
[00:51:54.060] - Big Rich Klein
The first time I saw a photo of you on the horse, I was like, Well, that's not something I thought I'd see?
[00:52:02.290] - Matt Deas
You know, man, neither did I, really. I mean, whenever I tell you my whole life now is based around it, it really is. I even ask him some days, I'm like, How the hell did we get in this situation? How did this hobby become our lifestyle, our way of life? I mean, really, it is interesting. So little backstory on that. I told you we had family in Florida, and Racehorses in Florida is Ocala area. That's the capital. When I had an uncle, My uncle, my mom's sister's husband was a train racer in Florida. So ever since I was a kid, when we would go at Christmas time or whenever and visit, I'd always want to go out to the barn with him and hang out because I was always fascinated by them, being powerful animal like that and just watching them work with them and train them and whatnot. My parents didn't have a clue about him, and I want one, but it's like, we don't really have... They had a lot of land, but they didn't have that type land to keep horses on. I was racing, and I was like, Whatever. Well, I got horses before I got out of rock crawling, but they were just pleasure, enjoyable type horse, just a hobby horse, basically.
[00:53:40.800] - Matt Deas
When I got out of rock crawling, I found, I was like, damn, I got more time to go ride my horse. So ended up with some buddies like, riding more and this and that and the other. And it involved just like the rock crawling did. Like, hey, man, they're having a big straight away event for speed horses in a place in Tennessee. I was like, Yeah, I'd like to see what that's about. And we always rode more of a pleasure type horse. Well, when you go to these events, it's a full on performance horse. I mean, they're full standard bread is what they are. They're basically horses off the track that they've taught that are not a buggy horse anymore. Now they're a riding horse. I was just like, Oh, my God, I got to get into This is awesome. It's like anything. It's a hell-efficient learning curve. If you're determined enough, you got enough drive about it, then sure, you're going to get better and you're going to learn stuff. Before you know what you're going to be, you're going to be winning a championship, just like the rock crawling. That's where I got with the horses.
[00:54:57.900] - Matt Deas
Just started educating myself and And full with them more and more and more and figuring out what bloodline to get into. I still learned today. I've been on top of the game and had a lot of success with it as well. And I still learn every day with it.
[00:55:19.230] - Big Rich Klein
And that's awesome. Let's talk about family a little bit. So you've been married, you've been with Kim now. You said 2022 years?
[00:55:29.210] - Matt Deas
Twenty years. Twenty years.
[00:55:31.650] - Big Rich Klein
And kids?
[00:55:35.230] - Matt Deas
Yeah. So Oakland is 11, and Hudson is... He'll be six next month. In February, he'll be six.
[00:55:45.430] - Big Rich Klein
Nice. And obviously, if you're deep into horses, they probably are, too.
[00:55:53.150] - Matt Deas
Yeah, Oakland for sure. Huddie has rode a little bit. I I tell you, you'll see some kids riding when they're real little, three, four, they're more or less a passenger. Really, a kid doesn't mentally mature enough to start riding a horse, in my opinion. Well, mine, like six, seven years old. So the little bit that he's rode, it's been pretty controlled or whatever. Now, Oakland, he's 11, and I was a little more pushy with him when I started, and he's actually turned in to be a pretty incredible... He's really a good rider, especially no more than he gets to ride. Oakland plays every single sport, come and going, he plays year-round. Literally, we'll get done with one sport. Sometimes they overlap, and we're practicing for football and basketball at the same time, or basketball and baseball. Then he also does a lot of times where he does Travel League with some other teams and stuff. He'll go play a tournament for a long weekend or something, and got to practice for that. So his horse showing once basketball's over, so springtime, March, he'll get to ride a little bit, but he'll show through the summer months.
[00:57:13.820] - Matt Deas
But now once football starts in July, he's done. He only gets to show April, May, June, and maybe the first or second weekend in July. So his riding has gotten cut short, but he caught on quick, and he's turned into a pretty good rider. I mean, he competes on a pretty big level, and he's had a lot of success. Awesome. Great. Yeah.
[00:57:37.730] - Big Rich Klein
And so I understand that you actually put a horse event on yourself? Yeah. You became a promoter.
[00:57:44.560] - Matt Deas
Yeah. Hey, man, you would have been proud of me. Yeah, it turned out really big. A lot of these shows we go to, a lot of times it's bragging rights. You get a trophy, and there might be a little bit of money involved. I guess just coming from the world of motorsports, I was always baffled. We would leave these shows, and I would just tell Kim, I'd be like, These people go crazy over a thousand bucks. It's very rare. You never hear of it, or you see it maybe once a year, whatever. I told her, I was like, We ought to put a show on, get some sponsorship, and really pump it up, make it big. Man, we We started this, it was actually November of last year when we started planning our show for May. Man, we ended up getting... We had some major payback in it. A lot of people said they had never seen that had been showing horses their whole life. They said, We've never seen a show with payback like that, nor have we ever seen a show that big. It was a big success. I mean, it was pretty incredible, really.
[00:58:59.330] - Matt Deas
I think we had 11 different states. Had a lady there from Belgium that she had flew in for the show. I had a professional football player there, Devon Wild, that plays for the Tampa Bay Bucks, was there. Showing his horse. It was a big thing. It was a really big thing, and we planned to do it again this year.
[00:59:22.060] - Big Rich Klein
Excellent. Cool. What's in the future for the Ds?
[00:59:30.670] - Matt Deas
It's probably going to be up to these kids. Right. We didn't start having kids until we were 30, 31, 32. I guess I was 30, she was 32. We did that for a reason. We traveled the world rock crawling, made a lot of great memories, and got to do a lot of fun stuff. We finally We said, Hey, if we're going to do this this time, we're not getting younger. But if we're going to do this, then we want to be able to be the best parents we can be. As far as being able to finance, and speaking them financially, and just saying, Hey, we want to be able to chase him around year long, if that's what he wants to do. If he wants to play ball year round, we want to be in a position where we can do that. That's what we did. When I say it's up to them, it's up to them. Do I find myself daydreaming and wishing that I could get back into rock crawling? I'd be lying if I said I didn't, because I think about it a lot. I guess if I knew people me all the time, Would you quit horses to get back into rock crawling if it would be like it used to be?
[01:00:51.290] - Matt Deas
The answer is, Yeah, I probably would. I love the horses, man. I've grown to love them. They're just like rock crawling. They make you They make you hit the person that you are today. They teach you a lot. Teach you patience, teach you sometimes things don't go the way you want them to go, and you got to learn to be okay with it. It's tough, especially whenever it's something that's got a mind of its own. You can only do so much because they're just like us. They're going to have good days, and they're going to have bad days. They're going to have days where, man, they're on. Then they're going to have days where you want to kill them. You're just like, What is wrong with this thing today? It's just the way it goes. But yeah, if I was guaranteed Amen Rock Crawlins, fix and make a huge comeback, and it's going to be what it was, 05, 06, 07, I would start making phone calls today.
[01:01:42.800] - Big Rich Klein
Interesting. Cool. Well, Matt, I want to say thank you so much for spending the time and talking about your life and all your accomplishments and everything you've been through.
[01:01:54.590] - Matt Deas
Man, I really appreciate the opportunity. I've enjoyed it. I I really appreciate it. I really do.
[01:02:02.790] - Big Rich Klein
Hopefully, we get to see you sometime down the road.
[01:02:06.950] - Matt Deas
Absolutely, man. Keep in touch. If you need anything, you got my number.
[01:02:11.710] - Big Rich Klein
All right, Matt. Thank you. Good luck, and I hope all the best for you and your family in the future.
[01:02:20.880] - Matt Deas
All right, Rich. Thank you. Okay.
[01:02:22.680] - Big Rich Klein
Thank you. Bye-bye.
[01:02:23.820] - Matt Deas
See you.
[01:02:25.880] - Big Rich Klein
Well, that's another episode of Conversations with Big Rich. I'd like to thank you All for listening. If you could do us a favor and leave us a review on any podcast service that you happen to be listening on, or send us an email or a text message or a Facebook message, and let me know any ideas that you have or if there's anybody that you have that you would think would be a great guest, please forward the contact information to me so that we can try to get them on. And always remember, live life to the fullest. Enjoying life is a must. Follow your dreams and live life with all the gusto you can. Thank you.