Conversations with Big Rich

Jeep Enthusiast Jim Horne in Episode 59

May 20, 2021 Guest Jim Horne Season 2 Episode 59
Conversations with Big Rich
Jeep Enthusiast Jim Horne in Episode 59
Show Notes Transcript

Energetic, friendly, and knowledgeable describes Jeep enthusiast Jim Horne as he joins us for Episode 59 to share how a kid graduated from a Missouri high school ends up in Pahrump, Nevada (for now). Lots of stories and laughs along the way with his strong, beautiful wife, Barb. 

2:56 – since I was born I’ve been around everything Jeep-wise 

8:14 – I don’t know if I maybe had anger issues, but I love playing football

9:47 – A couple of years ago, Barb was diagnosed with breast cancer

12:50 – I really got into this industry, it’s saved us

17:26 – it’s those personal experiences that build character

18:46 – we would shut the job down because he was yelling at me and I was yelling back

27:35 – aircraft mechanic jobs were flooded with ex-military, no room for me

34:41 – it was time to settle down 

37:09 – once you’re on the Rubicon, you’re not getting off until you’re done

38:57 – we started Outlaw Jeep Tours on the corner like a hooker

42:54 – Steve Nantz has been a key person in my life

46:25 – you’re living the dream

58:29 – I put her into a roll

1:04:34 – fighting vapor lock in the race truck

1:15:59 – you’re only failing if you don’t try


We want to thank our sponsors Maxxis Tires and 4Low Magazine. 

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[00:00:01.050] - Big Rich Klein

Welcome to the Big Rich show, this podcast will focus on conversations with friends and acquaintances within the four wheel drive industry. Many of the people that I will be interviewing, you may know the name, you may know some of the history, but let's get in depth with these people and find out what truly makes them a four wheel drive enthusiast. So now's the time to sit back, grab a cold one and enjoy our conversation.


[00:00:29.490] - Speaker 2

Whether you're crawling the Red Rocks of MOAB or hauling your toys to the trail, Maxxis has the tires you can trust for performance and durability, four wheels or two Maxxis tires are the choice of champions, because they know that whether for work or play, for fun or competition, Maxxis tires deliver. Choose Maxxis tread victoriously.


[00:00:56.070] - Big Rich Klein

Why should you read 4Low magazine, because 4Low magazine is about your lifestyle, the Four-Wheel Drive adventure lifestyle that we all enjoy, rock crawling, trail riding, event coverage, vehicle builds and do it yourself tech all in a beautifully presented package. You won't find 4Low on a newsstand rack. So subscribe today and have it delivered to you.


[00:01:20.510] - Big Rich Klein

On today's episode of Conversations with Big Rich, we have Jim Horne, some of you may know Jim, some of you may not.


[00:01:28.580] - Big Rich Klein

Some of you may wonder, why am I interviewing Jim? Well, Jim and I go back around the beginning of Dirt Riot. I believe Jim was a spotter for Steve Nantz, first at our rock crawls, and then we jumped into racing the Dirt Riot series with us. And then Jim left the area and started other endeavors. And we're going to get all into all that with with Jim right now. So, Jim, thank you for coming on board with us.


[00:02:00.320] - Jim Horne

Trust me, it's it's my pleasure, Rich. Any time I get a phone call or text from you, I'm always excited.


[00:02:05.600] - Big Rich Klein

And I think that's kind of overrating it. But that's good. Anyway, let's let's jump right in and let's start talking about like we do with everybody where you grew up and what your interest was as a young kid and and eventually how you got into this industry and, you know, your love of the of the industry itself. So where'd you grow up?


[00:02:32.870] - Jim Horne

Sure. Yeah. I was born in Yakima, Washington. We lived in the area for Yakima. My my grandpa owned an apple orchard. So I think almost anybody in this sport, they're outdoor individuals for sure. And that's the way I grew up. We I was born in Yakima, Washington. Do that all the way back in nineteen seventy one. Oh, wow. I'm getting old brother.


[00:02:53.630] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. You're still not as old as me.


[00:02:56.120] - Jim Horne

I know, but yeah, I grew up in the Washington State area and when I was a kid I grew up around jeeps. My dad back in the 70s. Racing a CJ five. We were a member of the Timberwolves Jeep Club back in the day. So for my my whole life, ever since I was born, I've been around everything you possibly could jeep wise. And I remember back, you know, five and six years old, like every kid does.


[00:03:23.600] - Jim Horne

Well, maybe not every kid, but, you know, handing my dad a wrench, you know, helping him pull a motor, just just things like that. And it kind of, you know, once it gets a hold of you, you can't shake it. And heck, I really haven't wanted to shake it.


[00:03:35.360] - Big Rich Klein

You know, I didn't I would never have guessed you were from Yakima. Really, we do we do an event in Goldendale, Washington, every year, and, yeah, I've competed in that with Steve. That was one dusty, dusty event.


[00:03:50.500] - Big Rich Klein

It's all that volcanic dust from the rock out there.


[00:03:54.820] - Jim Horne

Yeah, yeah, definitely. That was a good event, though. There's some there's some good stuff out there. I really enjoyed that. But it was really dusty.


[00:04:00.730] - Big Rich Klein

I remember that. Yeah. Everybody everybody likes the event. It's except for the dust. But you can't have everything you know, it's funny, speaking of that event, I remember I got into an argument with you over some rules about Steve and I crossed the cones and somebody, you know, they were trying to time it's out there like you timed out. And I was like, no. And you had to come over. And it wasn't heated between us.


[00:04:27.950] - Big Rich Klein

It was competitive. That's what it was when we were out there.


[00:04:32.300] - Big Rich Klein

Absolutely. I never think it's personal. And no, that's one reason I think I make a good promoter because I don't take. I don't take it personal, and that's one thing you can't you know, when you you hang around with a bunch of competitors and just like yourself, it is what it is when you're out there, you know, everybody shakes hands and drinks the beer after it's all over. And that's one thing I really loved about this sport is, you know, from from the competition side to the racing side or just even being out there on the trails, the camaraderie, you know, everybody is out there to help everybody out.


[00:05:06.390] - Big Rich Klein

And I really I've really enjoyed that. And I think that's what keeps me drawn into the sport. And just people people still help me. And I love helping other people. It's been fantastic. But anyway, back to my childhood. Yeah. You know, growing up in Washington lived there for about 14 years. Like I said, my dad always raced Jeeps and all my uncles did. So I've constantly been around it. After that, we moved to a place called North Poutre, Oregon, just a small town.


[00:05:33.570] - Big Rich Klein

And then your memories.


[00:05:35.760] - Big Rich Klein

Where is that? I've never heard of that.


[00:05:38.100] - Jim Horne

It's just let's see, it's south of LeGrande and just north of Baker are two of the bigger cities. Oh, really?


[00:05:46.660] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I've been all through all every single road there and I don't remember. Interesting.


[00:05:51.930] - Jim Horne

OK, yeah. So and then I remember replacing the spider gears of my dad's jeep, we had a CJ seven then I think it was in 1984 CJ7 and laying in the driveway, replacing Spider Gears when he blew those out when we were up in the mountains, messing around, doing the logging roads and everything in that area.


[00:06:11.320] - Jim Horne

Yep, yep. You know how that is especially going up in the Northwest or some beautiful country up there.


[00:06:16.750] - Big Rich Klein

Absolutely. Especially around those volcanoes.


[00:06:20.340] - Jim Horne

Yeah, definitely, definitely the landscape can change from depending on where the lava flows have gone in in the prehistoric times or, you know, to me anything over 200 years is prehistoric, you know, any of those those changes like that to the area really are dramatic in the volcanic areas?


[00:06:45.450] - Jim Horne

Yeah, yeah. For sure. And then let's say, oh, go ahead.


[00:06:50.160] - Big Rich Klein

No, I was going to say so in in school. Were you were you interested in any of the sports that the schools may have offered or were you one of those.


[00:06:59.970] - Jim Horne

Yeah, yeah I, I played a lot, a lot of football, you know, obviously in high school, back in the glory days, you know, high school and ran track. I was had some decent speed for who I was. It was funny because after I, we left Oregon, I only lived in Oregon for a couple of years or about a year and a half. And then we moved all the way to Missouri a while back.


[00:07:23.650] - Jim Horne

My grandparents moved to Missouri. And then my dad actually was he was born in Auburn, California. But then he lived a lot of our little quite a bit of time in Arkansas. And he saw an opportunity to go back there and kind of, you know, let us raise us there and move back there when I was 14 and being from Northwest and then moving to Missouri culture. I've never felt him. Oh, one hundred percent, dude.


[00:07:51.270] - Jim Horne

I've never felt humidity before. And we moved there in July. And yeah, that's something I don't care who you are, you don't get used to it. You just don't. But yeah. Anyway I move there and what you one great thing that came out of that, that's where I met my wife Barb. So you know, I don't ever, ever regret when I first moved there I was like, what the hell are you doing? And then, you know, after all that, play it out.


[00:08:14.460] - Jim Horne

It was great. But yeah, it was I was a pretty decent athlete for a shorter dude. I was always pretty quick. And I love playing football. I don't know if I had maybe anger issues, but I love to take it out on other people. Perfect. And then ran quite a bit of track also. But yeah, for me, I was and I wasn't very studious. I was just, you know, you go to school and hang out just because it's a cool thing to do.


[00:08:42.780] - Jim Horne

And then as soon as it was over, I was out of there. I barely made it through, but I did make it through it just in four years of high school. So that was. Yeah. Yep, that's right.


[00:08:51.900] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. You got you know, you get that high school diploma, at least you don't have to go back and get a GED.


[00:08:56.940] - Jim Horne

That's it. That's it. Two things. I'm proud of my high school diploma and well, there's a lot of things I'm proud of. But a high school diploma and and an honorable discharge out of the Air Force, that's not too shabby.


[00:09:08.940] - Big Rich Klein

So you said you met Barb in Arkansas. And what town in Arkansas were you?


[00:09:14.010] - Jim Horne

It was it was Missouri and it was. Yeah, no, that's fine. No problem at all, Rich. But it was Lake Ozark, Missouri. That's where I met her. OK, we've we've been married for thirty years now. I'll tell you what, that I put that girl through the ringer. She's she's she's pretty tough and she's kept me straight for a lot of years.


[00:09:36.760] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I would imagine she has. Yeah, she's a she's a great lady, that's for sure. And I'm glad she's she's back being healthy.


[00:09:47.140] - Jim Horne

Yeah, me too. And I appreciate you saying that, Rich. Yeah. A couple of years ago, she got diagnosed with breast cancer. And, you know, I've never I always knew she was strong and because she's always had to be strong to live with me for so many years. But, you know, I was with Jeep Jamboree when that was going on. And, you know, the year she got diagnosed was 2019. And, you know, I literally traveled three hundred and three days that year.


[00:10:11.770] - Jim Horne

And that's one thing to, you know, like like everybody, you know, in this sport, in this industry, you know, you choose to live a lifestyle and by no means are Barb and I rich, you know, we had health insurance and everything like that. But health insurance only covers so much. And when you say the word cancer, everything seems like it triples. And that's unfortunate. But she basically, you know, I could I would come home here and there just just to make sure she was OK.


[00:10:36.070] - Jim Horne

And but I had to continue to work to make sure we were paying the bills. And, you know, she understood it. And in that I I've never met a champion at life like Barb is. And I you know, I know everybody is like, oh, but now I mean, that's one of the strongest people, not just men or women, but one of the strongest people I've ever met in my entire life. So she always keeps she always keeps me straight and keeps pushing, you know, your marriage to Shell, you know how it is.


[00:11:01.710] - Jim Horne



[00:11:03.220] - Big Rich Klein

It's great that that I was able to find somebody that that not only. Would put up with my passion, but help me succeed in it. You know, that wasn't always the case in my life, and, yeah, the having Shelley help is really, really made a big difference. And I understand what you're saying.


[00:11:29.620] - Jim Horne

Yeah, I'll tell you what, Barbara, I know you and Shelley really well. And, you know, just to be able to hang out with you guys, especially competition wise. But, you know, that's the way we you and I met. But then you've become friends over the years and you start to realize how special people are that you're close to. And like you and I, you know, we see each other. Probably haven't seen you in a few years, but I feel like I talked to you yesterday or saw you and Shelley just a couple of days ago.


[00:11:56.710] - Jim Horne

I think that's one of the bonds that this industry creates and this sport, you know, there's a lot of things out there, but but nothing quite like the off road industry and what it brings into your life. As far as I'm concerned, for me and my family, you know, they our kids grew up and we lived in Moab with our with our Jeep tour business there. Barb and I started that from scratch. And the way that happened we owned an excavating company there in Salt Lake for a number of years.


[00:12:25.090] - Jim Horne

And then we had the crash of 07 and 08 and we watched our business really start to tail off. And jeez, I was thirty seven years old and, you know, we had a Jeep and we wheeled in Moab starting at about ninety seven, ninety eight, I think. And then you start to kind of see that go south. And this is one of the points that I was making with Barb being so strong. You know, it was funny at thirty seven, you know, I was like we had an excavating company.


[00:12:50.830] - Jim Horne

I was like, you know, for a guy that barely got through high school, we're doing all right. You know, we had a decent home on a little bit of land outside of Salt Lake and in a little back deck. And, you know, you looked you know, we had six acres and I was like, doing pretty good. And then to watch that start falling apart and then you're doing everything you can to save it. And that's I really got into this industry a little bit deeper, actually.


[00:13:12.380] - Jim Horne

It's saved us to say something weird, maybe. But, you know, we watch that downturn and we started trying to get out of our construction side. And I talked to Barb and I was like, hey, let's start a Jeep tour business in Moab. And money's just super tight. And she's like, all right, what do we need to do? And I was like, hey, let's go buy two, four doors. And this was in 07.


[00:13:35.260] - Jim Horne

And it's like, this is a great idea. So we bought we bought two four doors. And then there's a you you probably know Ben Hanks. Yep. I was hanging out with Ben Hanks in Salt Lake and I was like, hey dude, we need to build a bracket for a third row seat in this JK. And he was like, we could do that. So I went to his shop there and we we just built some bracket and I put a third row.


[00:13:58.630] - Jim Horne

It was a TJ seat bracket or mounted it to the floor through some seatbelts in there. And yeah, I started doing tours on the weekends and like I said, money was tight. I wouldn't even get a hotel room. I'd camp, I'd wash up on the river. Just stupid things, you know, you're just and it was so funny because we had that home, you know, on six acres and then, you know, you're trying to save everything you possibly can that you've ever worked for.


[00:14:21.010] - Jim Horne

And I just kind of everything just kind of worked out. And, you know, I always consider myself very lucky with where I am and what I get to do. But I also believe you make your own luck in a few of you. Work your ass off and you never give up. Good things happen to you and a lot of bad things happen to you also. But, you know, Barb and I have always put our head down and just push through it.


[00:14:42.610] - Jim Horne

And we try to build our Jeep tour business and rentals in Moab as fast as we possibly could. We literally moved to Moab. You know, the kids, the kids, Jake and Kenz, I think Jake was probably twelve or thirteen. I think Kenzie was 9 or 10 or, you know, she was nine or 10, 5th grade and 8th grade, so, you know, you always try to make that transition to where they don't realize what's going on.


[00:15:06.530] - Jim Horne

And Barbara, I did a pretty decent job at it because they had no idea what what was going down. And now but we moved to Moab in our fifth wheel and we just started pounding it out, pounds in and out. And, you know, within a year, you know, we were finally renting a house again and then bought a house. And then we were just buying more and more jeeps. And it it went it went fast as I look back on it.


[00:15:27.080] - Jim Horne

But when you're going through through life changes like that with the economy, it seemed like it took forever. So and it's it's really it's really taxing mentally and physically at the same time. And then but the thing to remember is for anybody listening to this, you know, the tough times, the hard times are what builds character. The easy times are what you know, that's not character building.


[00:15:54.710] - Jim Horne

No, I agree 100 percent. And, you know, just like I said, maybe when you're going through it, you don't realize it. But after you after you went through it, you're like, well, that really sucked. But, you know, the road ahead gets a little easier for sure. Right.


[00:16:09.170] - Big Rich Klein

And you learn along the way, you know, like, you know where to where to position yourself. I remember the the first time that we went into I think it was called Desert Storm. But when we went into Iraq, yeah, I had a really successful landscape company that just instantly disappeared in Northern California. And I was like devastated. I didn't I didn't know what I was going to do. I, I owed. So much to, you know, for the all the equipment that I leased and turning it in did not get rid of that because they said, oh, you still owed for what your lease agreement was, you know, things like that.


[00:16:51.510] - Big Rich Klein

And I learned, you know, no lease. Again, I either buy it outright cash or I don't get it. You know, those things. So you just take those kind of things with you for the rest of your life and hopefully don't make the same mistakes twice now.


[00:17:05.910] - Jim Horne

And that's that's totally true. That's kind of on there. On the excavating side. You're still even if you aren't leasing, if you're buying your equipment, you're making payments. Those payments still come in when you aren't when you are getting paid. You know, it's hard to make that stuff up, but it's it's stressful for sure. You and I have we've walked the same path here and there, haven't we? Yes.


[00:17:26.760] - Big Rich Klein

Yes. And I think that's what that would that's even if we've never sat and really talked about it, it's those kind of personal experiences that, like I said, builds character. And and you see that in other people, you see those same strengths or qualities. And so you're attracted to those. And I think that's what it is. Yeah, not that I think you're a handsome guy like that, but I mean, you are obviously because you got Barb.


[00:17:53.430] - Big Rich Klein

But, you know, I didn't mean it that way attracted wise, I want to clear that up for the audience.


[00:18:01.260] - Jim Horne

And there's nothing wrong with that, Rich. But it's so it's funny. Everybody says that I'm always the. Oh, that's all. That's Barb oh, here comes. Jim, Boy, He's really lucky. I'm really lucky. But I love that that makes my day every time somebody says that to me.


[00:18:15.600] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. Every time I see Rick Pewe, he'll he'll just walk right by me like I'm not even standing there. And give Shelley a hug and talk to Shelley.


[00:18:24.300] - Jim Horne

And I'm like, oh, I get it Rick. Yeah. You just kick kick dirt on Pewe's toes. He's always wearing those damn sandals.


[00:18:32.100] - Big Rich Klein

It's so true. So let's let's go back to to those days where, you know, back in Missouri, you met Barb. Was it like a high school thing or what?


[00:18:46.760] - Jim Horne

Yeah, I started dating her my senior year and she was a junior. So after I graduated high school, I, I went to work for my dad. He was into the excavating side. And, you know, not too many people's met my dad. But talk about a hard ass. Yeah, it taught me he taught me a lot. But every once while we would shut the job down because he was yelling at me and  I was 18 then and I was yelling back.


[00:19:14.550] - Jim Horne

But, you know, after those big old fights, you know, we'd have we'd always eat lunch together. And everybody was like, how the hell do you guys do that? Like, I don't know, maybe we're just stupid. But but he taught me a lot. He taught me, you know, he's he's passed away probably, let's see, probably seven or seven years ago now, seven or eight years ago. But, you know, when you you don't realize what your parents do for you or what they've done for you.


[00:19:40.410] - Jim Horne

But but my dad, he was a hard ass and he was always on me about, you know, just just do better, do better, do better and always expect the best out of yourself. But, you know, back in the day, it wasn't positive reinforcement. It was always negative reinforcement. He would always say to me, well, that's the best you can do, Jimbo. And I was just like, damn. Oh, yeah, it was he was one of those guys you can never make happy, but



Kind of like Red Foreman Yeah. Right. Yes, yeah.


[00:20:08.070] - Big Rich Klein

I think that's what I got a lot of that's so funny. And just like another thing to every every kid that's helped, it helped his dad work on something, you know, and you have to hold that flashlight. Oh, you never know when you hear those words. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, side story obviously on that. Yeah. And then Barb and I, I started dating her my senior year and then her junior year and then graduated and then I started working for my dad.


[00:20:36.600] - Big Rich Klein

And then when I was 19, I went into the military, I went into the Air Force, I was a hydraulic specialist on C5s. And then we ended up moving to Northern California. We were stationed at Travis Air Force Base back in the early nineties. So I spent a lot of time in the Middle East, you know, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Cairo, Egypt, Mombasa, Kenya, and places like that. So by the time I was probably twenty, twenty one, you know, I'd not maybe have been quite all the way around the world yet.


[00:21:06.210] - Big Rich Klein

But I've seen a lot of Third World countries and and a lot of things that, you know, you know, we're very lucky this world with with where we where we live for sure.


[00:21:16.230] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. I wish more people realize that. Yeah.


[00:21:20.130] - Jim Horne

Yeah. You know, and I don't I won't turn this anything, anything political because everybody knows how kind of we all feel because we're all in the same sport. So we share I'll share a lot of the values, but no matter what it is. Yeah. And no matter what it is here, it's it could be better, but boy, it could be a lot worse, and that's for sure.


[00:21:39.140] - Big Rich Klein

Correct, correct, yeah. So then you said to the military, how long did you spend in the Air Force?


[00:21:46.400] - Jim Horne

I did four years in the Air Force. Yeah, I. Go ahead.


[00:21:51.440] - Big Rich Klein

I'm sorry to see you. You were stationed in in Sacramento area.


[00:21:56.270] - Jim Horne

Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Travis Air Force Base. Yeah, we were Barb and I was stationed there for four years. Nice. So we actually really enjoyed Northern California, and by then I was still still in the Wheeling and I had a I was in a jeep but I had a nineteen seventy six ram charger and we take up on the Rubicon. And it was it was a lot of fun because, you know, you're young and dumb. You don't know any better about anything.


[00:22:25.150] - Jim Horne

I was 19, 20 years old but but we would just go up there and camp on the weekends and have a good time. It was only two hours from the house. So so we got to spend a lot of time up there. And it was it was really cool. Those are, you know, the funny. The older you get, the more you look back and think about things in your life and you're like, wow, that was pretty cool.


[00:22:44.320] - Jim Horne

You know, you never you never realize what you're doing while you're doing it. It just seems like it kind of sucks. But once you've done it and you look back, it's like that was pretty neat. So we really enjoyed living in Northern California. And then it was funny because, you know, after a while, I mean, this is like 20, 30 years down the road. But, you know, being being involved with Jeep Jamboree USA, you know, they're headquartered right there in Georgetown.


[00:23:10.540] - Jim Horne

So, you know, I spent a lot of time in Northern California, Barb would flyback with me. And we would go back to Travis Air Force Base and kind of reminisce about stuff. And it was it was a lot of fun.


[00:23:20.860] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, Travis has changed now. Well, all that has.


[00:23:24.460] - Jim Horne

But, you know, that's tremendously.


[00:23:27.500] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. I basically call Placerville my hometown, even though I was actually went to high school in the Bay Area in San Bruno, California. Yeah, the Northern California is my area, but Placerville is where I considered home.


[00:23:45.160] - Jim Horne

Yeah, yeah, you know, talking to Rich, your son. He yeah, he was saying the same thing. I get to spend a little bit of time with him here and there doing some of these launches for Jeep. And, you know, when I was with Jeep Jamboree and just getting a lot of history from him and but yeah, he was like I was Placerville Rubicon and everything. So that's kind of cool to share stories about that.


[00:24:08.890] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, we were raised them there. They were born and the kids were born and raised in Placerville. And then when I lost the landscape company, like I said, I went to the Bay Area and then they grew up in basically Pacifica, Napa area. And then we moved to Cedar City, Utah. And then really rich did three and a half years or two and a half years of high school there. And we moved back after Christmas of his junior year.


[00:24:40.000] - Big Rich Klein

We got through the junior football season. I didn't like the way the coaches were using him. And so we went to we moved back to Northern California and then the coaches sounded like they were going to be a great deal, Eldorado High School there. And then they ended up being the dumb asses. But you know that that happens.


[00:25:00.040] - Jim Horne

It does, it does so that's what we've known each other for a while, but I had no idea you guys hopped around like that from from there to Cedar City.


[00:25:10.150] - Big Rich Klein

Cedar City was great, though. I mean, the club president. And that's how I got into the rock crawling with the color country, four wheel drive. We helped Ranch Pratt get into Cedar City to out at three peaks and get his permit out there and and run the event and help with all that. And then that's when I made the decision that when I moved back to California that I was going to start Cal Rocks. And really that all happened and that that move happened in two thousand.


[00:25:42.460] - Big Rich Klein

And then we started Cal Rocks in two thousand and one.


[00:25:47.000] - Jim Horne

Man, that's that's awesome. I had no idea, Rich. No idea. That's really cool. And I love three peaks because it is a great arena.


[00:25:56.570] - Big Rich Klein

It really is.


[00:25:57.320] - Jim Horne

Oh, Steve and I, you know, we competed there are a few years together, and that's that's some hardcore stuff, you know, I mean, there's everything's just a little off camber, just enough to where you're like you're trying to you're trying to dodge those cones and you're like, yeah, you know, just just walking those courses together. And, you know, you always have a game plan till you get punched in the mouth and you're tired of right up against a cone, just like shit.


[00:26:22.160] - Jim Horne

Didn't see that coming.


[00:26:25.430] - Big Rich Klein

So true.


[00:26:26.180] - Jim Horne

So true. You gotta do it because you're sadistic when you set those courses up. You and Josh, I hated you guys. Sometimes I was like, are you kidding me? Oh, did you get the map and walk the bonus line and see? When I look at it, it's kind of like, Jesus Christ, come on.


[00:26:41.450] - Big Rich Klein

What's what's he. What's he on?


[00:26:44.240] - Jim Horne

Yeah. Yeah. But talk about a lot of fun.


[00:26:47.120] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. It has been. And it's going to continue to be so good in Northern California. You got through the Air Force. Yeah. Did you stay in Northern California. Where did you go after that.


[00:27:01.670] - Jim Horne

No, I was I was getting ready to get out of the Air Force and, you know, everybody was like, what are you going to do? And I was like, I don't know. You know, that was an aircraft mechanic. But when I was getting ready to get out, that's when Clinton came into office. So he started Riffe in the military, which is called reduction in forces. So even if you had an ANP, an airframe and power plant license and everything like that, by the time it was my turn, he was he was that they were paying individuals to get out of the military, you know, not really because they were just reducing the force size, obviously.


[00:27:35.880] - Jim Horne

So my my plan was to become an aircraft mechanic because that's what I'd done for the last four years. And, you know, you start putting in applications and they're like, oh, you know, no matter what airline you put them in for, you were so far at the bottom of the list, you know, you weren't going to get hired no matter what your qualifications were, because it was so flooded with ex military that were already out a year and a half to two years ahead of where I was.


[00:28:00.440] - Jim Horne

So I went on vacation when we were kids in Colorado and I said, you know what, I want to move to Colorado. And I told all of our friends that I was like, hey, we're moving to Colorado, you have a job. And I was like, nope. And then it's so funny because I was seven months pregnant with Jake when when I got out of the military and she was just like she was like, let's just go.


[00:28:23.540] - Jim Horne

And anyway, all my friends were like, you guys are crazy. I was like, maybe I'll figure it out when we get there. You know, we had maybe three thousand dollars to our name. We loaded up in nineteen ninety five and moved to Florissan, Colorado. Wow. And I had a little bit of pay coming from the military still and just lucked into a construction job and started making some decent money. And then we traded Barb had a nineteen ninety three probe and see what was I driving then.


[00:28:52.150] - Jim Horne

I think I, well I had my ram charger and then we got to Colorado, we got rear ended in that ram charger. They fixed it up and I mean I was seven months pregnant I rareness in the snow and then we ended up selling that ram charger and we bought a nineteen ninety five YJ and that's the YJ I sported in Moab for so many years that Steve and I built. What had put a tremendous job that turned out to be was that if I could get a few things back, that YJ would be one of them.


[00:29:20.060] - Jim Horne

I think it's somewhere in Oklahoma right now. But anyway, yeah, we moved to Colorado, lucked out, got a decent job. It was called Cripple Creek Gold Mine. And I was an operator. You know, you pump out sixty hours a week. So we were making decent money. You know, you get time and a half or anything over twenty. And then we lived there for about a year, maybe about a year. And then Jake was born and then we ended up moving down to Prescott Valley, Arizona.


[00:29:50.730] - Jim Horne

Barb's parents lived in Cottonwood and they're like, hey, come down. You know, it's really nice. And so we visited a couple of times. And then the company I was with, industrial constructors, they actually had another gold mine that they were doing. And you guys know it because it was down in Baghdad, OK, Baghdad, Arizona. So we moved down there and hung out for a little bit for a year or two. And then that's then I worked for them for a while when we were living in Prescott Valley, and then they ended up going to Salt Lake.


[00:30:20.900] - Jim Horne

And that's how Barb and I actually ended up in Utah. And that was in ninety six, ninety six or ninety seven. And it was ninety seven. Junon ninety seven. I think so. And then that's. Go ahead.


[00:30:31.940] - Big Rich Klein

I'm sorry. Who owned the gold mine in Baghdad at that time. Right now it's it's Freeman McMorRan or McMorran. Something like that. And it's there mainly copper.


[00:30:43.570] - Jim Horne

Yeah, I'm sorry, you know what, it was the copper mine, OK? Yeah, I worked for a decent amount of gold mines when I got transferred up to or we moved up to Salt Lake. I worked at Kennecott. And that was all copper also. Yes, yeah. Yeah. And I can't remember what's what was the Baghdad mine that was 20 some odd years ago.


[00:31:04.570] - Big Rich Klein

That's crazy. I have no idea.


[00:31:06.790] - Jim Horne

I know I don't know that Freeport McMoRan is what owns it now. And it's just as far as I know, it's just called the Baghdad.


[00:31:15.020] - Jim Horne

Yeah. Yeah. That's I guess it was the Baghdad mine when I was there also.


[00:31:18.760] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. As opposed to the big one they have down south in Arizona. I can't remember Morrissey.


[00:31:25.030] - Jim Horne

Yeah. OK, OK. Is that all open pit copper down there too. Yes.


[00:31:29.830] - Big Rich Klein

In fact Morrissey's one of the largest open pit mines. I think it's the largest one in Arizona.


[00:31:36.100] - Jim Horne

Yeah, I'll be. Huh.


[00:31:38.590] - Big Rich Klein

But that's a sidebar.


[00:31:40.390] - Jim Horne

Yeah. Yeah. I've got a lot of sidebars I guess that in the story of my life. But yeah we so we, we still have that ninety five YJ and then once we got to Salt Lake, you know we were, we were doing OK and then you know the first thing back in the 90s I was like, oh, I'm buying a set of copper shackles and I put that com for two inch counter shackles on that YJ And then it's so funny because I've known Dennis Wood with Tereflex.


[00:32:09.460] - Jim Horne

You know, back in when he was back with me, they had Metco. Right. And he's a he's a pretty good staple in my life because Dennis and I, we go way back. Ninety six or ninety seven is the first time I met him. And then, you know, I was buying parts from him and then you know, that YJ and then I was like, oh, let's do a spring over and then you make some, you draw it out or you take it out on the back of your YJ You're like cutting it and you're not even set up to be cut yet.


[00:32:37.420] - Jim Horne

And I comp cut the Jeep, but I'm like, what the hell was I thinking? I'm six inches too short. I need to push the axle. So stupid stuff like that. You know, I look at pictures, you know, the barbs taken back in the day at a photo album, and I'm looking through that. I'm like, what the hell was I thinking? So it's just it's amazing how your life evolves in the sports evolved, but now it seems like it goes so fast.


[00:33:01.600] - Jim Horne

But yeah, YJ with the spring over, that was thirty five and thirty sevens man that was, that was the shit back then was big stuff. Oh dude you are can.


[00:33:13.510] - Big Rich Klein

So then you got into construction on your own, you left the gold mine, the copper mine?


[00:33:19.180] - Jim Horne

Yeah, yeah, I started working for another company after I left Kennecott because they were they were getting ready to move up, move up to Wyoming. And so, you know what? Let's see. I'm trying to remember because we did do we lived in Beatty Nevada. Let's see, when the hell did we live in Nevada? That's how we kind of got a taste for Nevada. But I was still with the same company. Let's say I left.


[00:33:46.000] - Jim Horne

Oh, you know what? I left Arizona. But when I left Prescott, Arizona, if anybody knows Badir are Bayti, Nevada, they'd be like, why would you move debating Nevada?


[00:33:54.730] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, yeah, I. I had I had relatives there in my first marriage.


[00:34:01.390] - Jim Horne

That's so funny because I mean, if you blink and miss the left turn and baby, you know, you've miss Nevada so you go a mile over the speed limit, you get a ticket.


[00:34:10.810] - Jim Horne

Oh man. That's one thing too about Nevada because we still live in Nevada, the the small town speed limit at twenty five to thirty five. It's way too slow. Yeah. And they mean, you know, they do mean it. They definitely made it. So we lived in Bayti, we went from Arizona baby Nevada for about six months and we worked at Kinko's Bullfrog Gold Mine with the same company I was running Dozers Scraper and everything. And you know, you work that many hours and back in the day was it was really good money and it was easy money.


[00:34:41.740] - Jim Horne

I was always been decent running equipment. So then after we moved to beedi, then we went to Salt Lake and then we finished up with Kennecott and they were getting ready to move to Wyoming. And Barb was pregnant with Kenzi. And she said, I don't want to move anymore. And I said, I agree. We're in our twenties. We probably need to settle down just a little bit. And so I got a I got a job as an operator with a company called Paule excavating in.


[00:35:07.780] - Jim Horne

I always had a pretty decent knack for being able to move dirt fast because I was with Industrial and they were a high ball, dirt moving company. And I started it was a smaller company. And and I ended up being able to move dirt pretty quick for them and became a superintendent when I was like twenty six or twenty seven. I'll tell you what I thought I was high roller did not take my salary was sixty thousand a year. And then I had my own company truck and I was like, whoa.


[00:35:34.090] - Jim Horne

And then I was twenty, twenty eight or twenty nine and and we already had Jake in Ken's kids was born and everything. And then we bought Bob and I bought our first house and it was out in Eagle Mountain, Utah. And then that you know, just being around everybody. And like I said, I've met Dennis and we were hanging out and then I met a kid named Ben Hanks. And at the time, you know, and still, you know, he was he was cutting edge with everything he was doing and and got to know him really well.


[00:36:02.440] - Jim Horne

And we did some things together. And then that was kind of the the birth of of what we're buyable. I started on the off road side. You start wheeling in Moab. Once you go to Moab, you know, you're you know, you're just hooked. Right. That's that's one of the there's two places I believe in if you're a wheeler, even if you're on the East Coast and with with Jamboree, I've been really lucky. And I've got to spend a lot of time in the East Coast, and I never realized how spoiled in the West we were because of of all the open land we have and just deal with the Wieland's phenomenal.


[00:36:39.220] - Jim Horne

And you get back to the East Coast and, you know, they've got some really cool stuff out here, which I'm in Alabama right now at Russkis off road products, you know, just helping him out and had a nice soft place to land when I left Jamboree. And I've known Rusty for quite a few years and it's been really cool. But anyway, another side note. But, you know, with what we have out in the West in the wheeling, and then you get out here and, you know, they scrimp, scrap and save for every trail they have out here, most of us on private land in.


[00:37:09.700] - Jim Horne

But yeah, you get to the Mecca, too, like I say in long story, longer two trails or two places you need to go, you need to go. The Rubicon is going to be the hardest trail you've ever done. No, but it's just awesome because of the history of whaling and the sport. And it's one thing I love about the Rubicon is it's constant. Once you're on it, you're on it. There's no way off of it except for to get off of it.


[00:37:34.420] - Jim Horne

And it doesn't matter if you're dead towed out of there or whatever, but it's some of the most beautiful scenery and just phenomenal whaling that I've ever been lucky enough to do. And then same thing with Moab. You know, you just you can't say enough about Moab. And, you know, I wasn't wheeling my lab back in the 60s, 70s or 80s. I was there in the late nineties. But most it really changed. I think, you know, you have the introduction of the A side by side, and I'm not knock on the side by side, so I don't do any.


[00:38:03.940] - Jim Horne

Hey, everybody. But I think that changed it. I think that yes, I think it changed the feel of MOAB and. You've got a lot more a lot of a lot more money coming into Moab now, and it feels different even when Barb and I go back and our daughter Kenzie and her husband, Trevor, they still live there. I love to go back and visit. And it was phenomenal. Barb and I lived there for almost 10 years with our business.


[00:38:29.610] - Jim Horne

And now we just had a we had a really good time. It was a great place to raise our kids there. And Kansas still a big part of the community. And like I said, Barb and I love to go back, and that's how we ended up starting to get back to where I was earlier, I guess Rich with, you know, outlaw Jeep tours. When we started this whole off road industry thing that we had going, it was just it was great.


[00:38:57.180] - Jim Horne

And when we when we started that, we didn't have a lot of money by any means. And, you know, I used to I sat on the corner and I felt like such a hooker sitting on the corner. And I literally had to four doors in my YJ and my Wijaya was huge. It was wrong over no little springs, but it was running for these giant. But I sat there on the corner and in a lounge chair and I took my first tour out and we did.


[00:39:24.090] - Jim Horne

Helzer Just the bread and butter for any tour companies. It sells binge. And I called Baumol's like I just took my first tour, you know, and we still had some employees up there with our excavating company. Everything was holding its own. We were losing our ass, obviously, but it was it was holding its own. And so I took my first tour out. And then the big plan is to go to the overlook and then you turn around and come back off the overlook.


[00:39:50.010] - Jim Horne

So, you know, I had I always like you know, I got a couple hours worth of bullshit, I guess. So I can I can get through these guys and run it in and out. So Barbes like it just never came off a Helzer revenge backwards. But from like I'll be fine. I've done Helzer revenge. I don't know how many times. So this is a true story which I get to the overlook. It was it was an older couple.


[00:40:11.190] - Jim Horne

They just had great personalities. They made the whole trip really good for me because, you know, you you know, you're just trying to make everybody have a good time. You're trying to educate them. And so they're having a good time. So we get to the overlook and they're like, oh, my God, this is the most beautiful thing I've ever seen in my life. Right. So we start coming up and I get through the sand, you start heading back and I'm just like, holy shit, where am I?


[00:40:36.780] - Jim Horne

And all I heard, Richard, and this is this is a totally true story. I heard Barbara's voice in my head going, I told you so. I told you so because she was always like, you need to go run it off backwards. But I was like, oh, I'll be fine anyway. You know, you just stick to the trail and you're just like, oh, thank God I know where I'm at. And it turned out to be.


[00:40:58.080] - Jim Horne

And it's I feel terrible because it's it's been quite a few years now, but I can't remember the names, but they were just the best people and they made my trip. And that's kind of how this whole tour thing started, was with those two older individuals that just made my day. And then we started making making a little money with it. And then, you know, you end up having to Gbps and you have three jeeps. And then, you know, I don't know if if if you've been to Moab back then, Richard Ferebee with very big friends, I wouldn't put a bug in his ear.


[00:41:30.990] - Jim Horne

And I said, hey, you know, if you ever want me to take a couple of jeeps off your hands and help you start writin these out, you know, love to you. And then, you know, we he who's like a couple of months later, we had our shop, had shop downtown, the loft just right behind the first car wash. They're off a three hundred street. And he was like, you know, actually, no, it was a little bit before that.


[00:41:52.740] - Jim Horne

It was after that. I'm sorry. You know, so much the older you get you start realizing how lucky you've been and everything you've got to do and then just you kind of forget about things here and there. So we ended up doing that with Fairbreeze. So we had a couple of rental jeeps and then we kind of teamed up with Richard. And, you know, at one point in time we probably had a little over 30 rental jeeps, you know, between Fairbury and I on on our lot.


[00:42:20.670] - Jim Horne

And Barb and I were still up and coming, so we didn't have. Very we will act. I don't think we had any employees at the time, so I would go deep, go do Jeep tours and then Barbara be the office written out about probably 15 to 20 jobs all by herself in the morning. Talk about wanting to kill you. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I'm still I'm still surprised I'm alive. So but anyway.


[00:42:43.660] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, character building.


[00:42:46.060] - Jim Horne

You write character building. Barb has a lot of character.


[00:42:50.650] - Big Rich Klein

Well, she has you. So she has an extra amount of character.


[00:42:54.610] - Jim Horne

Yeah, exactly. You know, and then after that it just kind of you know, and that's one thing too. I can't say enough about Steve Nance. You know, he's he's been a key person in my life. And, you know, I started doing my thing. He started doing his recent hurricane and he just crushed it with Sand Hollow right now. But I spent all he was he was definitely my brother from another mother for sure. We spent day in and day out.


[00:43:22.480] - Jim Horne

He was helping me and we were building things together. And then that's how I ended up meeting you. So I just so you know, I kind of blame you for this little addiction I have with competing and racing and everything now, because the first time I ever competed was with Steve and his little moonbuggy. I was hooked. I was like, yep, I can't shake this.


[00:43:42.520] - Big Rich Klein

That's good. That's my job.


[00:43:45.370] - Jim Horne

And you do a really good job at it. So and that's one thing, too. You start to realize, you know, and then you kind of get into the ultra floor side. And then we did the we did dirt right together. And then, you know, you start to feel like it's it's something that I don't need to do or want to do. You have to do it. And that's the drive, the passion I think this industry has with a lot of people.


[00:44:09.740] - Jim Horne

And it doesn't matter, I don't think what end of the spectrum you're on from. Wow. I just want my first jeep to have been racing for years. It's the drive that you have to do it. And one thing to when Bob and I, when we were in Moab and, you know, we got to guide everybody under the sun from a five hundred dollar rig to a, you know, a two hundred thousand dollar rig. And it never I never cared what people brought in for us to guide or to go have a good time with as long as they enjoyed what they were doing.


[00:44:44.530] - Jim Horne

And I could teach them some things when we were guiding them. That was the most important thing ever to me. And like I said, I really didn't care what you had. If you're willing and you're having a good time, that's all this sport means to me. And it might upset a lot of people out there right now, but I didn't care if it was a Toyota or if it was a Jeep or whatever you had. Just get out there and enjoy what there is to wheel.


[00:45:09.010] - Big Rich Klein

Exactly. I've never been brand specific.


[00:45:13.380] - Jim Horne

On brand specific, but I won't say anything, I don't want to I don't want to get no hate hate, no drama is good for me.


[00:45:21.200] - Big Rich Klein

I get it. I get it. So let's talk about after Moab, you move back to Nevada for a little while.


[00:45:32.040] - Jim Horne

Yeah, we actually yeah. So when we left Moab, we'd lived there for probably almost 10 years, I think. And, you know, Jake, kids graduated high school. And, you know, a lot of people, you know, they're they're all you can ever wield too much. That was literally guiding two hundred and fifty days a year. Steve and I were competing and then I was racing ultra for and the unlimited series with with John Picken.


[00:45:58.280] - Jim Horne

And I started to get burned out. And I wasn't making it enjoyable for the individuals that were walking through our door any more. And so Barb and I actually ended up selling our our our Jeep tour and rental business and then our house. And we moved to Mesquite, Nevada. Well, we didn't actually move. We bought a motor home and we had a trailer. We told a jeep around for a while and that was forty, forty five when that happened.


[00:46:25.620] - Jim Horne

And it was like, oh my God, you're so lucky. You're living the dream. And Barb and I were scared shitless because we had no idea what we're going to do. You know, it's not like we had four million dollars sitting in the bank. And I was I wasn't worried. It was like, oh, we got enough to survive for about six months. But let's see what we can figure out. And then so we moved to escape.


[00:46:44.250] - Jim Horne

And then I started talking to Steve, which just a super great friend. And I was like, you know, there's I think there's a need for a fab shop down here. And he's like, You think so? And I said, yeah. I said, you know, I think sandhog is going to be up and coming and, you know, little ritual's down there. And he was doing this thing and he's just been crushing it. And he's like, well, let's look into it.


[00:47:06.910] - Jim Horne

And I was like, yeah, that sounds good. So he came down and and we all started talking and everything. And that's kind of where we came up with the idea with Sound Hollow off road. And Steve still you know, we still owned Moab four by four outpost. And so Bob and I were down there a lot and we kind of got it up and running. And I was excited for sure. And then, you know, kind of got to where because I my biggest thing was I didn't know what I wanted to do yet.


[00:47:32.940] - Jim Horne

And it wasn't a midlife crisis. But you're trying to make the right moves to set yourself up for the rest of your life. And that's what I feel like I was doing. And I'm still doing it right now. And then we got that up run and everything was good. And Steve ended up selling Moab for about four outpost and then moving down to Hurricane. And he was moving down. And I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do because Sanaullah was just it's a phenomenal shop and it was awesome.


[00:47:58.770] - Jim Horne

But it wasn't what I wanted to do at that point in my life. I thought it was, but it was. And so, you know, and this will be a back note a little bit with Giambra USA. So I met I started doing work with Jamberoo USA in Moab back in probably 08 or 09. They started rent some of our jeeps, probably a oh nine. I think they started renting some of our jeeps. And I got to know people like Greg Kaczmarek and then Sean Gullwing, which is the vice president for Jamboree and was always guiding down there because that's when we started our business on was the guide side.


[00:48:37.410] - Jim Horne

And so we rented a couple of jeeps and they're just like, hey, we're we're short some guides to would you be interested in guiding for some of these corporate trips? And I said I'd love to. And then, you know, with with Owen in that business down there, we got really lucky with falling into the Jeep themselves. We got to do a lot of R&D with some of the newer platforms they were coming out with. And then it kind of coincided with me doing jamborees stuff.


[00:49:01.830] - Jim Horne

And then anyway, so I got in really good with Jamboree and then in twenty seventeen after Steve and I got sand hollo up and running, you know, like I said, I wasn't, I wasn't, it was a great I loved it but it wasn't what I wanted to do. So it was nothing to do with Steve or Sand Hollow off road. It was where I was personally and where I wanted to be. Pearson lost, he's the president and the CEO of Jamboree, which is a super solid dude, I'd done a lot of things with them and built a couple of great or not racecourses, but a couple of courses for some launches.


[00:49:38.070] - Jim Horne

And he said, hey, you know, we're getting ready to do the jail launch in New Zealand. Would you like to go? And five people in the world got to go to New Zealand and do the launch for the new to twenty eighteen j.l. And I'm like, who passes that up for real? Nobody. So I talked to Steve and I was like, dude, it's been great, but this isn't where I want to be in life.


[00:50:02.850] - Jim Horne

You know, you've got more money in the business and I've got time in it, which didn't cost me anything. I want to be out, I want to sign everything over. And he's like, really? And I said, yeah, I said, I love you. You know, I want to just make make sure everything's OK. And that's when I stepped aside from Sand Hollow and Steve moved down after he sold the outpost. And then I started my stint with Jamboree.


[00:50:27.000] - Jim Horne

And so, you know, we went to New Zealand and did the jail launch and then we were back again in twenty nineteen to do the launch. And that kind of started my, you know, my side career with Jeff Giambra, USA. And now what a phenomenal experience that was. I've got to do a lot of things that people dream of doing, and when you're doing them, never realize what you're doing. And I stepped away from Jamboree March of this year, and that was just I still travel a little bit right now in the rough seas off road products are getting our ducks in a row here with both what we want to do with our shop.


[00:51:02.730] - Jim Horne

And but just getting to do that and everything that that entailed was was pretty awesome. But the travel side of it, everybody thinks you have the glitz and glamor life, which I'm not knocking it whatsoever because I don't want people to like. Oh, you're so lucky. I was super lucky. I've been I've been very lucky with what I've got to do. But waking up in a different hotel room every night for three hundred nights a year for three years, it got a little tiring.


[00:51:30.570] - Jim Horne

So I started figuring out my exit strategy from there. And it was nothing to do with Giambra USA once again, kind of like with sand, although I loved everything I got to do. And the people that are involved with Jan, from Pearce to Shaun to Tide to Jake to reach everybody that had anything to do with their literally top shelf people, just hard workers and, you know, seven days a week, 15, 17 hours a day, nobody cares.


[00:51:55.980] - Jim Horne

You just want to get the job done. And that's where I think the devotion to the sport and to this industry, you know, it doesn't matter what side you're on, if you're on the jamborees side or if you're a builder and you're producing parts for people, you're always just trying to do the best job for everybody else to make sure they're always happy. And I love that about this sport.


[00:52:16.380] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, it's every everybody that's in this truly has a passion for it or they're not in it very long. Right. You know what I see a lot of guys are you know, they work for a company or they they have their own company and they they just change business cards. They never step out of the industry. Very few most know. Most just find another avenue to continue that passion.


[00:52:47.270] - Jim Horne

Yeah, and, you know, and that's that's funny you say that because, you know, that's hitting home with me right now. That's exactly what I've done. You know, you might not be moving forward, but you're moving sideways in the same direction with what you want to do. And when you're devoted to this type of lifestyle, you are you can't shake. And I don't want to shake and I don't think anybody in this industry does right now, like you said.


[00:53:12.740] - Jim Horne

Oh, I'm sorry. Go ahead.


[00:53:13.680] - Big Rich Klein

No, no, keep going.


[00:53:15.470] - Jim Horne

Oh, I was just saying you might change business cards, but that doesn't change your heart. Different name on the door, but you still want to do what you're doing.


[00:53:23.360] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. What I was going to say is my my grandfather, you know, asked me when I was really young what I wanted to be in life and I wanted to do something outdoors. I was thinking along the lines of a forest ranger fish and game, something like that. And he says, OK, that's really that's really good. But as you get older, think about what it is in life that you love to do and then figure out a way to make a living doing it.


[00:53:48.800] - Big Rich Klein

And what you've said living he explicitly told me that he wasn't talking about how much money I could make doing it. It's how I got to live my life. And so for the first forty two years, I was I was in and out of all sorts of different businesses, whether I was working for somebody else or started my own. Until I finally found what it is that I wanted and that was off road and I knew I loved offered my first time on the Rubicon was in like eighty one.


[00:54:17.510] - Big Rich Klein

And wow, I was like, you know, I've got to continue doing this. It's this is this is really cool. And you know then. I was able to continue being involved with the sport as as an enthusiast, and then then I stepped into the event promotions after helping other people with events and figuring out what I could probably do this as well. So, you know, it was part of the passion. And I've been able to make a living at it.


[00:54:45.460] - Big Rich Klein

Not a great living. But, you know, it wasn't about the money. It's about the passion.


[00:54:50.580] - Jim Horne

Yeah, you you hit it right on the head for my story. Also, Bob and I, we we've never been rich. We've been poor a few times for doing this. But, you know, if I can continue not to have to grow up and do this, but I'll guarantee I'll do it till the day I die. And, you know, obviously, like everybody, you want to slow down sooner or later. And, you know, dude, I'm pushing the big five.


[00:55:16.410] - Jim Horne

Oh, I'm forty nine right now. I'll hit 50 in August this year. So all of a sudden I feel like a probably a woman that hasn't been pregnant in her late thirties and that clock is tick tick ticking right now because I'm like I don't want to work forever but I just want to get out, you know, just, just get far enough ahead in my life to where in my sixties. I just want to be able to piddle, make a little money.


[00:55:37.320] - Jim Horne

But I don't want to have have to say I just want to have want to. That's what that's what I'm shooting for. Yeah.


[00:55:42.720] - Big Rich Klein

I'm sixty three now. So like I keep telling everybody I've been doing this, this is my twenty, twenty first year of putting on about twenty years of, of rock Krall's series. Yeah. I can't, I, you know at sixty two you do the math, I can't do it for another twenty years.


[00:56:01.500] - Jim Horne

I know you like to and the older you get you don't realize are like I'm not speaking for everybody, for myself. You don't realize you're getting older until you start looking at your age and your number. And I try not to pay attention to it too much. But you just like you said, you can't do for another twenty years, you're not going to live forever.


[00:56:20.610] - Big Rich Klein

So it's the now Haines that remind you that feel aches and pains weren't that bad at it. It's sixty. It's sixty is when I realized I had a lot of aches and pains.


[00:56:32.850] - Jim Horne

Really. Yeah I, I look I, I go to sleep at night and I wake up with a damn sports injury. I'm like what did I do last night. My sleep. Yeah exactly.


[00:56:43.230] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. I Shelley that one time I, I already had a knee injury on my left knee and we're in Moab. We were staying at Grandpa's garage during Easter. Geep and I stayed up late at one of the parties. Went back. Yeah I didn't fall. I didn't do anything to my knee that day. We were on the trail, I hiked a bunch but we get I wake up in the morning and I went to get up and I'm like, Jesus Christ.


[00:57:09.120] - Big Rich Klein

And I looked at Shelley and I said, Did you put me in a figure for yesterday and wrenched my knee or something last night? And I was like, I know you fall down coming back to the room.


[00:57:22.710] - Jim Horne

If I did, I don't remember exactly. I know Shelley I think she's beating you at night, which you probably deserve it. Do I?


[00:57:31.830] - Big Rich Klein

Probably. If she did, I did. There's no doubt about it.


[00:57:36.840] - Jim Horne

That's so funny. Hey, man, just real quick, I would like to honestly, I'd like to thank you and Shelley for what you guys do. It meant a lot to my family, especially when Kinsey was younger, because I got to compete with Kinsey in her little YJ for a couple of years. And just to do something like that with my daughter and Barb, it was it was pretty phenomenal. You know, you don't you don't get things like that.


[00:58:02.790] - Jim Horne

I think a few people get something like that maybe in a different side of what their life is. But that was our life and it's been those times. And to walk those courses with my daughter, it was it was pretty special. And maybe a lot of people get it. Maybe a lot of people don't. And one of the biggest things, kids rolled a couple of time competing. And Barbara Kinsey and I would always be upset with Barb because the mom, she would always drop the camera during the roll.


[00:58:29.190] - Jim Horne

And you just missed the best part. Kids, you took a hard roll. She broke her front output shaft. And we needed the bonus points. And I was like, I'm putting you on a roll. You just need to drive out. I was just like, OK, that. So I've got some great GoPro footage of it. But she hits it. She starts going over and Rangeley, Colorado, you know, off camera, Rangeley is.


[00:58:49.920] - Jim Horne

So she starts going downhill. She hits a big rock with a right front tire, breaks the outlet shaft in the case, and then she just rolls down the hill. I run up to her and I said, can you drive out of it? Because she was just on her side and she tries to drive out the front. Wheels are spinning. So anyway, I was watching the GoPro video of it, and you can hear his talking and she's like, you need even ask her if she was OK.


[00:59:13.690] - Jim Horne

I knew she was OK. She had a cage around her. So it just goes back to the lifestyle. Just the competitiveness just brings a lot out of people. And Kenzi loved it. It was just it was a really special. And our lives with all that rich, and you provided that for us and and and you and Shelley and we and our family really appreciate it. You've done a phenomenal job of what you've done for the last 20 some odd years.


[00:59:37.040] - Jim Horne

Well, you've succeeded, dude. You've succeeded that. If that's my legacy, so be it. And I'm proud of it.


[00:59:43.850] - Jim Horne

You should be, man. You totally should be. So and that's the same thing. Yeah. Just competing with Steve on the other side of that, just just really, really good times. Just a lot of just a lot of good memories and strategies and emotions that go on during those competitions. Yeah. You can't beat it.


[01:00:03.660] - Big Rich Klein

That's why I continue to do these, because it's the people that that are in the sport. The enthusiasts that watch the sport, the companies that that help us put these on. Everything about it is just it's such a family that, you know, this covid thing. You know, we had an extra long off season coming into this into twenty, twenty one. And we are off season also. And there was no SeIma, there was no off road expo.


[01:00:37.230] - Big Rich Klein

There was all this stuff that you're used to doing what we call the show season after the competition season that we couldn't do, we barely were able to do the rebel rally. There was all sorts of stipulations and controls and all that kind of stuff. And so after that, you know, we we just we had nothing to do, you know? I mean, we still had things to do, but not not people orientated. You know, we still had the the magazine and Shelley Scott or other businesses that we work on.


[01:01:08.520] - Big Rich Klein

And, you know, it was really hard to get to leave the boat and get back to rock crawling until I got to Texas for the first event. And it was like, oh, my God, I've missed this. And then when everybody showed up. It was even more so, yeah, and that's that's that's that's something you've built you've built an extended family. That's your family. You don't have to be blood to be family. And that's what everybody knows when they go to one of your events.


[01:01:43.720] - Big Rich Klein

And that's the same thing with with any race event. It's amazing how that brings people together and what it does. Barb and I, right now, we've you know, we've got super lucky and we get to race in my hobby for Jeep. And it was it was hard pressed last year. You know, we were dealing with Giambra, USA and covid hit, like you said. And, you know, Pearsons, like, you know, we need to we need to save our money, watch what we're doing.


[01:02:08.410] - Big Rich Klein

And and he wanted to get rid of it, not get rid of the truck. But he was like, I don't think we're going to break it this year. And I was like, oh, OK. And, you know, I said, and this is before I ended up leaving, I said, hey, if it's all good with you, would you mind if I talk to Jeep and see if they'd want to put it in the program in our name Barbaresi I law.


[01:02:31.630] - Big Rich Klein

And he's like, no man. Golfers love to love to see that truck keep keep racing. And, you know, we have some friends on the engineering side with Jeep. And I started reaching out and, you know, when SCA started merging with Peugeot and the other big names to Lantis. And that was that was all this year. So the truck was kind of just sitting in limbo for so long. And then two weeks before the Silver State, three hundred in the best of the Desert series, you know, I got an email from them and they said, hey, this is Brian with marketing.


[01:03:04.450] - Big Rich Klein

We'd love for you to continue to race the truck. And, you know, I already laid out my schedule. I thought they'd give us the go ahead, probably two months ahead. But, you know, when when was you know, the wheels of those big cogs turn very, very slow. And for me, it's everything in my world for them, they're like, yeah, you matter. But dude, we're all making sure we all have jobs.


[01:03:26.170] - Big Rich Klein

So I'm firing off e-mails and pictures every day and and everything like that. So they came they came back and said, yeah, you know, you weren't going to move it from the engineering side to the to the marketing side. And so two weeks, you know, and then we've reached out to sponsors and we've had sponsors for years. But you don't want to be that guy that's asking for something and they're sending you something, especially nowadays, because everything is shows so shorthanded and backordered.


[01:03:52.750] - Big Rich Klein

So Barb and I, we had sponsors, but we weren't asking for anything yet because we didn't know if we were going to get to keep the truck. And we built it last year. And, you know, Jamboree and Barb and I, you know, we've got a lot of time and blood, sweat, tears and money in that truck and terrasse at one time at best in the desert. We did the Vegas to. And then I got taken out at mile one sixty four.


[01:04:13.210] - Big Rich Klein

And, you know, you just. Yeah, just like we were talking about earlier, you know, it's not something I need or want to do. I have to do it. And so two weeks before the silver say three hundred, they're like, hey, you have the truck. And Barb and I hadn't taken any product and everything's back ordered and we didn't even know if we had enough money to to get the truck off the line. And this is a no bullshit story.


[01:04:34.270] - Big Rich Klein

Once again, we fought a lot of vapor lock with that truck. So I put a pressure regular fuel pressure regulator in it. And I'm dumping fuel back to the fuel cells quick as I can get it back on. Like I think this is from last year. Towards the end of the year, I was like, oh yeah, everything's good. We took at the MOAB and I did some some rippin around in the sand with it and did a couple of jumps.


[01:04:54.350] - Big Rich Klein

And I was like, hey, it seems like everything's good. So we went to tack a few weeks ago and Vegas and of course, you know, Vegas has had great weather. Seventy five degrees. We drive the truck which we live in Pahrump, so I don't want to trailer it. It's fifty miles from the house. So we drove it. There was ninety five, almost one hundred and two in the parking lot. So we go and register and everything like cool, we fire up the truck, we're sitting in the tech line and all of a sudden I start here, chirp, chirp, chirp, chirp, chirp.


[01:05:21.880] - Big Rich Klein

And I was like, Are you kidding me? Oh, the truck vapor locked up and I'm running a dual fuel pumps and it just it just the system tandem system. So Barbes like, babe, are you kidding me? The truck is going to vapor lock up. So we're intech we had to push it off the line. We couldn't even get through tech yet. We pushed it off the line. I'm tearing the fuel system apart in the parking lot, not dumping gas everywhere.


[01:05:46.930] - Big Rich Klein

Just so everybody knows it was all controlled in the bed of the truck. So I get it down to one fuel pump. And then so we get back in the tech line items from the truck, turn it on and off, on and off. So we finally get to the tech side of it and the truck dies. So, Barbara, I literally pushed the truck in the tech. And then, you know, we get attacked, it passes, so I'm like, all right, we had to drive 60 miles back to our house that that truck vapor locked up probably 10 times on the side of ninety five and 50 until we were sitting on the side of the road.


[01:06:21.670] - Big Rich Klein

Rush hour traffic ritual. So stressful. Like, are you kidding me? This is terrible. So anyway, you know, they they say it takes 60 votes to run that motor so that the fuel regulator dialed on 60 miles. Like, forget it, I'm open to this damn regulator up. I'm running this truck on 30 Keerthi. I open that regulator up and it was and the truck ran perfect. And I was like Are you shitting me.


[01:06:46.690] - Big Rich Klein

So we started heading home and I was like All right, we got out towards Red Rocks getting ready to head over the springs there you know the over the hump to Pahrump. Right. So I said, all right, this is going to be stupid, but I'm going to pull over the side of the road because you're just in too late. Then I said, we're going to let this truck idle and we'll see if that Idle's idled like a champ.


[01:07:07.240] - Big Rich Klein

So far, when I you know, the next day, you know, we headed out to Alamo, Nevada, and we raced the truck. And I was just like and I only had I had I had both fuel pumps still mounted, but I was only running the low for lower fuel pump. But I left everything off, just capped off the pumps just in case I needed to swap it during the race. And so we drove it all the way there because they want us to stay as pure as we possibly can.


[01:07:32.440] - Big Rich Klein

So we literally drove that truck two hundred miles to Alamo, Nevada, and I raced it three hundred miles. We finished the race and everybody that follows us on Facebook, we ended up taking second place, which to finish any attrition race. And I literally, you know, you got the Chevy boys out there with the whole team and you had Mel out there with even those guys are the best of the best. They so nice. You know, we we didn't even know if we had enough money to end up racing this thing.


[01:07:59.650] - Big Rich Klein

I called Kenzi and Trevor, which is her husband. She's five months pregnant. And and Trevor, just you they they own Quick Lube Shop there in Moab. And I was like, hey, and this was this is this is not a bullshit story. I called Kinzie at five o'clock Thursday night before we were getting ready to attack after we and I can't say enough. I'm not going to pump a bunch of stuff or but twisted Jeep rentals in Moab.


[01:08:25.630] - Big Rich Klein

If it wasn't for them, we probably wouldn't race that race. They came through sponsor wise, big time and it worked. It worked out great. So I called cans and Trevor, they're like, we're in. So she's five months along and Trevor knows a ton about cars and he's been around this race and could be in her whole life. So, yeah, we put the wheels on the damn truck in Bahrain. I pulled out three hundred miles and finished second.


[01:08:46.120] - Big Rich Klein

And if anybody's ever raced anything, that's that's an attrition race. Just it doesn't matter if you're first or last. First is always nice, but to cross that line in an attrition race like that, there's no other feeling like that in the world. And it was odium as well. That's you still you may not have gotten on the top of the podium, but you still podium.


[01:09:07.780] - Jim Horne

That's it. Yeah, we did. Yeah, we podium. And it was it was a it was a really good feeling, especially with everything you go through and, you know, people, you know, you're on Facebook, you're always living your best life. Everybody always does. You know, who wants to see the negative or how hard it is with this and that. But, you know, there's a lot of side stories, not just of my life, but everybody that's in this industry and do what they do.


[01:09:31.750] - Jim Horne

You don't work eight to five and you don't have millions of dollars. You're doing whatever you can to succeed. And that's what we've always done. And Barbara and I were successful. And it was a lot of it was a long, hard road and. But to get to the end of that road and to cross that finish line, it's been a long time since we've crossed one. It felt, you know, you can't you can't imagine the feeling.


[01:09:56.110] - Jim Horne

I couldn't you know, for me, the right seats, the wrong seat. And she started KOH Drive in last year with me. And now I was going to have kids KOH drive. And I was like, well, I think I might want to KOH drives. And after she went through breast cancer and survived and her life is completely changed and that girl is basically she's always been up for anything, but now she's more of a risk taker.


[01:10:20.870] - Jim Horne

I'm just like in but she's she's KOH drive like a champion. She's been in my right seat for 30 years, so she knows how to you know, when to talk, when we know when to talk to each other, when not to. When we're stressed, we both just be quiet. And if there's a hard turn coming up, it's a hard turn coming up. OK, thanks. You know, and we just we work really good together.


[01:10:41.200] - Jim Horne

But the cross that finish line with her is by one of those special moments in my life. And I've had a lot, you know, obviously, that the birth of our kids and, you know, your wedding day and things like that. But the cross that finish line, after everything it took to get that truck there, when we crossed the start line for last for this for this race, we had already won. As far as I was concerned, I was like, man, it's just a stressful fire and all these emails and just trying to put things together.


[01:11:10.660] - Jim Horne

But it worked out. And, yeah, we were we were super happy with it. And then, like I said, they're like, hey, we want you guys to race this and we're going to try to figure out a better way to promote it as far as especially breast cancer awareness and things like that. We want to do some type of a nonprofit. And once you you know, if you know somebody with your cancer, you went through cancer yourself or a family member.


[01:11:32.320] - Jim Horne

You know, there's a lot of unknowns. And, you know, because there's so many different types and things and tests and because you're scared, you don't know what's going to happen. And it's been for us, it's been a it's been an amazing road. But anyway, long story. Longer than I'm probably going on too long. But no, no, you're doing your Paule pulling a lot of things out of me. But to get across that finish line, it was it was awesome.


[01:11:57.160] - Jim Horne

I had that the feeling was really good. So anyway, it takes a lot of people to put that together.


[01:12:02.740] - Big Rich Klein

Well, if we can do anything to help you get your nonprofit together, I'm going to volunteer Shelley. Sure. You know, she she's amazing at all of that kind of stuff. She's research. She's done it before. You know, there's anything that we can do to help. Let us know, you know.


[01:12:21.520] - Jim Horne

You know, we will we'll definitely reach out, Rich, because you guys are phenomenal promoters, along with the people you guys are you have so much respect in the industry. We just want to raise a little awareness, Barb, and I've been hit by it. And that's to try to bring this interview down by any means. But, you know, people get interviewed and they want to talk about the business side of everything. And I'm more I'm a I'm a real personable kind of guy.


[01:12:45.850] - Jim Horne

And, you know, these are the things that interest me and I like to talk about them. So I don't want to bore anybody, man.


[01:12:51.100] - Big Rich Klein

No, you're not you're not boring anybody. Trust me. So so then let's let's talk about the outlaw off road business that you're starting in. Sure.


[01:13:05.860] - Jim Horne

Yeah. You know, and that's one thing to obviously when we sold our jeep to and rental side, you know, you always sign a non compete, which that's no big deal cause I never want to get into the tour rental side, but we always kept the four wheel drive side. You know, that's so funny because we have a good friend up in Reno that produced some bumpers and rock sliders for us. I got a a damn storage shed full of them.


[01:13:28.810] - Jim Horne

I haven't sold yet. I need to get on that just with our live take such a spin, you never concentrate on it. But but now I'm I'm getting a little older, so I do feel the tick tock. And yeah, we're going to start to just it just probably a one man shop right now, just just myself. And, you know, I don't want to do this. Sounds stupid, but. You make a lot of money doing a lot of things, but the more money you make, more money just bolting on little kids, bumpers, lights, stealing some gear sets and some things like that, and that's what I want to concentrate on.


[01:13:59.730] - Jim Horne

And do I think it's going to be a Cinderella story? No. I mean, it'd be great if I had 100 people that were lined up with their cars in jails for me to put two to four orange life kits on tires, wheels and bumpers. But that's just what I want to do. I enjoy it. Kind of decent amount of experience with what we've done in the industry and, you know, you know how to build things, you know what works and what doesn't work.


[01:14:20.700] - Jim Horne

And we I think of one of our biggest strengths is we listen to people, you know, what are you using your jeep for? Oh, you know, I wheel it on a one week in a month and then my wife drives it around or I drive around to work. Well, great. I'm not going to throw a forklift in a set of Forty's, you know, and a long arm kit. I'm going to want to build it for what you're using it for.


[01:14:40.290] - Jim Horne

Exactly. So. So, yeah, that's that's what we want to start from. Like I said, it's it's not a multimillion dollar operation by any means. We're going to start small and mom and pop it to death and and hopefully enjoy a little bit of our lives. It's nice to take a step back or if you can take a step back, still pay the bills, you know, and do what we can. But, yeah, I want to I want to start slowing down just a little bit.


[01:15:03.990] - Jim Horne

Not a whole bunch, but a little. You start to pay the bills and throw a little money in the bank because I do want to do what I want to do, not have CAPTUS. But right now we'll see if we can get that up and running by the middle of June is what we're thinking and harrumphs. Not the Mecca for off road, but we live there now. And I never realized how many jeeps actually rolled through Pahrump and I never realized how many friends we have in Vegas.


[01:15:26.800] - Jim Horne

I started talking about doing it then, you know, you got four or five people reaching out, going, why, we live in Vegas. We'll come over. I'm like, oh, and then you really start you realize it'll be like, hey, this might really work. So you know what? Maybe it's going to work, maybe it doesn't. But I would definitely rather look back on my life and go, damn, I can't believe we did that instead of look back on my life and go, man, what if we would have done that?


[01:15:49.440] - Jim Horne



[01:15:49.740] - Big Rich Klein

So we should have tried. At least that's it. That's it.


[01:15:54.080] - Big Rich Klein

That's my belief is you never failed unless you you don't try.


[01:15:59.720] - Jim Horne

One hundred percent rich, I mean, I agree, and one thing is, is you you're only failing if you don't try. If you die and it doesn't succeed, you haven't failed. It didn't succeed. But if you never tried, then you failed.


[01:16:16.280] - Jim Horne

Yeah. And even when you try and it doesn't work, still learn something. So that's still a you know, it's a win loss. It's a 50 50, I guess. Yep.


[01:16:24.570] - Big Rich Klein

Agreed. So what are they? Give me a little list, if you can, of the things that you want to do not need to do. You know, you say there's you know, you you want to spend some time doing some things, what's on that list of things you want to do?


[01:16:41.740] - Jim Horne

You know, what I want to do is I would I would like to race a little more, you know, just just like I've said before, once said once you get that bug, it's it's hard to shake. And it's not something I want to do or need to do. I have to do it. You know, it'd be cool to take that top spot on the podium one day. You know, we've got some some stiff competition and, you know, we just race the pure stock class.


[01:17:05.600] - Jim Horne

It's so funny. You know, we've had some some culture for cars and everything we've got to build along the way. And we're racing from Vegas to Reno. You know, you're on the bottom end of those shots because it's stock. And that's one thing to you have to I had to totally relearn how to drive, especially being a and, you know, you can't be hard on it because you've got to make three hundred miles or five hundred miles and Barbes like this thing rides for what she's used to, triple bypasses, coil overs and stuff, you know, and I'm like, it's just a stock truck.


[01:17:41.410] - Jim Horne

I said, this thing is an animal. And then she really learned how how tough that truck was. But anyway, back to your question. Yeah, I would. You know, Barbara, I want to just build a home in Pahrump. That's something I would love to do. I'd like to have a you know, I don't know if we're gonna have to rent some space in Pahrump, but I'd like to build a house and build a shop just behind the house, you know, maybe have two or three or four acres and run the shop right from our house.


[01:18:11.590] - Jim Horne

And I know that business wise, it's not as smart because, you know, you can't sell your building. You can't sell your business, really. But, you know, retirement for me, like I've already said, probably three or four times, it's not have to it's just want to choose. And I want to continue to work on a little bit of stuff here and there, make a little money on the side, even when I'm in my sixties.


[01:18:33.010] - Jim Horne

So I'm not looking to build some massive empire and sell it. I enjoy working on Jeeps and interacting with people. And, you know, there's nothing better than doing a good build and watching people enjoy or sending you a picture or coming back again to upgrade a little bit there. Like, you know, everybody builds on a budget. Some budgets are a lot bigger than others. But it's really nice to see, you know, the growth of a Wheelin family.


[01:19:00.190] - Jim Horne

You know, they're like, oh, I just want a little too much less is some thirty fives. And then next thing you know, like, wow, you know, a three inch lift to maybe thirty seven or forties. Can you bump stop it down a little bit so my forties don't rub. Yeah. No problem. So I enjoy that, I enjoy making people happy and watching them grow. And I think that comes back from the Jeep tour side.


[01:19:19.540] - Jim Horne

When you have somebody that buys it a jeep and comes to Moab and Moab, you know, it's very intimidating, you know, for the people that have been there for years. Obviously it's not. But if if you've never been there, it's pretty intimidating. So, you know, they they hire guys like myself or all the great guys that are out there. And you show them a few tricks of the trade. You know, the biggest trick I can ever teach anybody is drive with two feet, you know, breaking your gas.


[01:19:44.620] - Jim Horne

It makes everything so much smoother and you don't have to go hammer down, learn how to pick a line. Yes. But to see everybody enjoy that and watch them from the beginning of the day where they're scared to death and nervous to ever go out by themselves, which you shouldn't go by yourself, always take somebody with you. But if you do, make sure you know, somebody knows where you're at. You've done it. I've done it.


[01:20:06.610] - Jim Horne

We've all done it a million times. But to give to give a family confidence in, you know, the team or whatever you're feeling, doesn't matter if it's a Toyota or whatever you're wheeling. The vehicle is always way more capable than the individual that's behind the wheel. Just is always has been. Always will be until you get that experience. And you know exactly what if you rolled a few over, you know exactly what a vehicle will do.


[01:20:32.740] - Jim Horne

Yes. But by the end of the day, you've taken a family out or an individual and you've given them confidence in themselves. And, you know, I know it sounds corny and stupid, but it was really satisfying for me because I knew they were better wheelers for it. And maybe they're not going to make a stupid mistake and get hurt or break the vehicle and it makes them better people. Oh, I mean, any time you learn something, you know, and it can be basic, you know, trail etiquette or or how to how to approach an obstacle or whatever, you know, some of that filters through in the in the rest of your life.


[01:21:14.140] - Jim Horne



[01:21:14.770] - Jim Horne

Yeah, yeah, I agree. 100 percent rich. And that's one thing too. I think after, you know, I'm not an old school wheeler, but I think of myself as an old school wheel. I've been doing it a long time. I think trail etiquette that's starting to become a little thing of the past. Maybe not. But, you know, you sit here and there, you're like, wow, what's up with that?


[01:21:35.260] - Big Rich Klein

So, yeah, I think part of it is, is people not. Like when I learned to wield it was an open no power steering, I mean, there was you didn't have all the tools that the new vehicles are sold with. And no, you know, the capability of the vehicle was was not is not there like it is now. So you had to you had to learn some finesse. You needed to learn how to read the line and and use your tools accordingly when I will.


[01:22:11.250] - Big Rich Klein

Now I you know, I'll wheel in one wheel drive and then I'll go to front and rear, then I'll start using the lockers. But I never I never throw everything at it just because, you know. That's that's what everybody else is doing, and I've seen that too many times, especially now that I've been done a couple of media runs where we're maybe with a tire company or somebody, some other company, and and they've got guides. And the guides are saying, OK, put their lockers on.


[01:22:43.570] - Big Rich Klein

And I'm like, why? Yeah, well, because you have them. So use them. It's like, well, why don't you teach people how to how to do this without your lockers first. Yeah. They become better wheelers and getting less trouble. I think. Less less recoveries, you know, less rollovers, if you if you use your tools accordingly, instead of just using them all at once, you know, when you don't need it, because then when you do need it, you know, you're in over your head.


[01:23:14.090] - Jim Horne

So, yeah, one hundred percent. And that's one thing, too. I think, you know, the way everybody builds now, you know, you have a lot of you have a lot of people with a lot of money. You have some people, not a lot of money, but you see a lot of individuals that can throw a ton of money under their vehicle. And then they've never had to learn how to drive around 40 two and walk around rear with six thousand forty one and cromarty shelves and I just go up everything.


[01:23:40.210] - Jim Horne

No, no, no. You need to strip that all down. Get yourself a YJ or with a five speed in a four cylinder open, open. Go learn how to drive. And that's the way that's the way our kids were raised. You know, learn how to pick a line. And one of the biggest things I think with with what you and Shelley do with WE Rock is you learn how to finesse. You don't need to hammer down on everything.


[01:24:02.080] - Jim Horne

A lot of a little finesse will get you a long way and it saves your rig for sure. You're never out of control. You might need to do a little bump here and there, but once you get to the top, back out of the throttle and look ahead of you. So I. I agree 100 percent with what the driving it's it's going to be a thing of the past, not for everybody. And I don't mean to upset anybody, but I think open open with some thirty threes, go out and learn how to drive.


[01:24:28.310] - Jim Horne

You'll have a different different perspective on everything when you're wheeling or.


[01:24:32.680] - Big Rich Klein

Um, I always, I always suggest to the new teams that come out to WE Rock is. If before you come out and compete, you should come out and judge and not only that, you actually learn the rules that way, but you get to see other people succeed or make mistakes that hopefully you can learn from. And then the other thing is, is if you don't do that, they should all all the new guys should watch the judges video at least so that they can at least learn the rules.


[01:25:06.470] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, nobody reads. Very few people are prepared when they come out there, you know, and they think they you know, it's you know, there's like no rules. There's fifty nine or fifty three pages of rules, you know. Yeah. Take your time and read them.


[01:25:23.540] - Jim Horne

That's it. You know, it's very important to read rule. Yeah.


[01:25:29.090] - Big Rich Klein

Anyway, you know, I want to say thank you for taking the time in and discussing your life and your family and your passion. And I think that I think people are really going to enjoy this interview. Even though I've never met you, Jim, they're going to they're going to take things away from it that hopefully they they can build their life and their passion in this industry from things that you've experienced and you've done and and the way you've been.


[01:26:01.340] - Jim Horne

Well, I. I mean, I really appreciate that every day is a learning day for me. I think once you know everything in this business, you need to get out. You're not going to help anybody or yourself anymore. But and I and I really mean this from the bottom of my heart. Rich, when, you know, you shot me a text and asked me if I would want to be on your podcast. And that was that was a lot of honor for me.


[01:26:21.140] - Jim Horne

Did it meant a lot? It means a lot just to you know, I think you and Shelley are our top shelf people. And like I said, to get that phone call, I was I was pretty cool. It's it's my life. I'm not full circle, but it's getting there. And I've just been I've been super lucky to to get to do some of the things I've got to do. But thank you very much.


[01:26:41.960] - Big Rich Klein

And that's the story you had to tell. And I think that that that's important. And that's what I get out of these podcasts, is learning things about friends, but also those friends sharing their life with our listeners. Really, you know, it's really important in the long run whether people think it is right now or not. They're going to glean some information out of everybody's podcast and hopefully it helps them in their life and that means we're succeeding.


[01:27:12.980] - Jim Horne

So that's that's awesome that the support of your family, that's all you can ask for. There you go. I've had it for sure. I know you have to so.


[01:27:21.140] - Big Rich Klein

Well, Jim, thank you for spending the time. I know that you probably need to talk to your wife, but yeah, give our give our prayers and wishes to everybody in the family and say hello to McKenzie for me, because I am I haven't seen her in a while. The last time was I stopped for an oil change and and they did a superior job.


[01:27:45.920] - Jim Horne

So they spend every day.


[01:27:49.790] - Big Rich Klein

Oh yeah. I didn't remember her and I apologize to her for that.


[01:27:54.410] - Jim Horne

Oh yeah. Last time you saw her she was probably seventeen or eighteen to twenty three now so that no no apology needed.


[01:28:01.490] - Big Rich Klein

Brother grow up. They sure do.


[01:28:04.160] - Jim Horne

Yeah. Yeah. All right. Cool. Thank you so much Rich. I appreciate it.


[01:28:07.700] - Big Rich Klein

OK, you take care.


[01:28:09.200] - Jim Horne

All right. You too. Bye bye. Bye.


[01:28:12.840] - Big Rich Klein

If you enjoy these podcasts, please give us a rating, share some feedback with us via Facebook or Instagram and share our link among your friends who might be like minded. Well, that brings this episode to an end. OK, you enjoyed it. We'll catch you next week with conversations with Big Rich. Thank you very much.