Conversations with Big Rich
Hear conversations with the legacy stars of rockcrawling and off-road. Big Rich interviews the leaders in rock sports.
Conversations with Big Rich
Racing and Rockcrawling with our favorite Cowboy on Episode 232 with Mitch Guthrie Sr.
Mitch Guthrie Sr. was raised a cowboy and became a Champion UTV Racer. He shares life in the fast lane with us on this episode of Conversations of Big Rich. Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.
3:27 – We were always riding horses, I was constantly getting pulled out of school.
8:34 – I heard about Azusa Canyon, back then, it was a wide-open four-wheel drive place
16:23 – It was a passion. It was all I thought about.
28:50 – Back then it was a little tougher without GPS, I remember going the wrong way around the wrong side of the mountain
42:44 – my favorite is the week of KOH when Mitchie is going to race, we drive the sh*t out of those trails
45:40 – Any advice? Yes, pay attention to those who are winning, listen, and be humble
Special thanks to 4low Magazine and Maxxis Tires for support and sponsorship of this podcast.
Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.
[00:00:01.140] -
Welcome to Conversations with Big Rich. This is an interview-style podcast. Those interviewed are all involved in the off-road industry. Being involved, like all of my guests are, is a lifestyle, not just a job. I talk to past, present, and future legends, as well as business owners, employees, media, and land use warriors, men and women who have found their way into this exciting and addictive lifestyle we call off-road. We discuss their personal history, struggles, successes, and reboots. We dive into what drives them to stay active and off-road. We all hope to shed some light on how to find a path into this world that we live and love and call off-road.
[00:00:46.160] -
Whether you're crawling the Red Rocks of Moab or hauling your toys to the trail, Maxxis has the tires you can trust for performance and durability. Four wheels or two, Maxxis tires are the choice of champions because they know that whether for work or play, for fun or competition, Maxxis tires deliver. Choose Maxxis. Tread victoriously.
[00:01:12.750] -
Have you seen 4Low magazine yet? 4Low magazine is a high-quality, well-written, four-wheel drive-focused magazine for the enthusiast market. If you still love the idea of a printed magazine, something to save and read at any time, 4LOW is the magazine for you. 4Low cannot be found in stores, but you can have it delivered to your home or place of business. Visit 4Lowmagazine.com to order your subscription today.
[00:01:39.650] - Big Rich Klein
On today's episode of Conversations with Big Rich, I'll be talking with an old friend, somebody I haven't talked to for quite a while, but take care of that right now. He's an O. G. Rock Crawler turned UTV racer, none other than Mitch Guthrie Senior. Mitch, how have you been?
[00:01:56.730] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I've been great. Just Working and watching Junior Race pretty much nowadays.
[00:02:04.090] - Big Rich Klein
Right on. You did well training him. We'll get into that. Let's start off with the easy question. Where were you born and raised?
[00:02:11.640] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I was born in Glendora, California. I was actually raised, though, on Palomar Mountain by the observatory.
[00:02:21.320] - Big Rich Klein
Oh, wow.
[00:02:21.990] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
You know where that is? Yeah. I was born and raised up, or I was born in Glendora, I was raised up there. We had a big ranch, and cattle and 5,000, almost 5,000 acres. And I grew up a cowboy.
[00:02:37.470] - Big Rich Klein
Nice. I didn't realize that that was that land up in that area.
[00:02:44.220] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, it was my stepdad. He had a bunch of land up there and raised cattle, fatten them up, and then sent them away in the winter and brought them back in the spring. And I went to school up there, kindergarten through eighth grade was only 28 kids. And once I did that, I went to Falbrook High, an hour and a half bus ride every day for four years.
[00:03:10.500] - Big Rich Klein
Nice hour and a half.
[00:03:12.410] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Hour and a half each way. That was a Long day.
[00:03:16.570] - Big Rich Klein
So growing up as a cowboy, during those times when the cattle were on the local acreage, you had cowboy duties?
[00:03:27.420] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, we gathered cattle. We were always riding horses. We all had our own horses. And it was a constant get pulled out of school. My stepdad would say, Go saddle the horses. Today, we're going to gather cattle and ship some out, or we're going to move some from one meadow to the other. So it was nice. And also, he had a heavy equipment company, so got to do that forever when I was a kid, riding on dozers and all that stuff. It was fun.
[00:04:00.450] - Big Rich Klein
Nice. And what was school like for you? Were you a good student or were you one of those that were looking out the window, wanting to jam?
[00:04:10.280] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I was terrible. I was looking out the window, wanting to out of there every second. Yeah, I got a lot of trouble when I was in school, believe it or not. I never was the best student in school. Okay.
[00:04:24.850] - Big Rich Klein
But you've done pretty good for yourself.
[00:04:27.340] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. I ended up moving off of Palomar Mountain. Oh, gosh. I was probably 19, 18, somewhere in there. And I moved to Glendora, back to Glendora, and lived with my dad, and started driving a concrete truck. When I was 18 years old, I really didn't have a license to do it. Brand new Peterbilt. Worked for my wife now, Stephanie's stepdad, and did that for a couple of years. And then I got into framing houses and condos and all this working for my dad. And I worked my way up from a laborer all the way up to run and work. And then in '96, I got my own business going.
[00:05:11.590] - Big Rich Klein
Nice. Very nice. So in high school, with that commute to Fallbrook, was it... Did you have... At some point, were you able to get off the bus and drive your own car?
[00:05:25.720] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I did a little bit towards the end. I had a brand new Ford F150 four-wheel drive, and I would drive it once in a great while because the gas, I couldn't afford gas.
[00:05:37.070] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah, that's true.
[00:05:38.080] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I also worked up there. From when I was 14 years old, I worked at a school camp. There was a few school camps up there. So get off school on Friday, and then go to work Saturday and Sunday, and then go right back to school. A busy life back then.
[00:05:55.680] - Big Rich Klein
Were you able to play any sports, or it was too busy with the cattle? No. The cattle?
[00:06:01.960] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, I didn't really play any sports. Baseball a little bit. I tried a little football at Fallbrook High, but it was just too much to go up and down the hill for my mom and me, and I wasn't really into it.
[00:06:15.400] - Big Rich Klein
Okay, fair enough. What was that high school like? I know you probably carried on with the same attitude as a school student. But what was coming down in the mountain and be in the cowboy life and then going to Fallbrook, was there a big transition there?
[00:06:39.010] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
A little bit. I mean, honestly, everybody down there was surfers and stuff because in Sanitas and all that's right there, and they were all surfers. So I tried to play into that role. I would dress that way, then get back home and switch back. I never really was a surfer or anything, but I tried to play it that way. I did I also did some AG classes there in Fallbrook. They had really good classes for animals and welding. I learned to weld there, got to be a pretty good welder, Arc welder back then. Okay.
[00:07:14.130] - Big Rich Klein
Perfect. Okay. And then so, at 18, 19, you go to work for your dad, and you're driving your driving concrete trucks.
[00:07:25.340] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. It was my stepdad, not stepdad, my I'm sorry. My wife's step dad
[00:07:32.050] - Big Rich Klein
Okay. All right. So you were already married by then?
[00:07:36.760] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
No, I got married when I was 26. She was 20. We got married young. But yeah, I worked there for a while, and that's how I met her. Every day, I'd go there to turn in my paperwork, and she was there waiting all flirty and whatever. When she was young, I was older than her, so I didn't really pay attention. And then it just kept going. And pretty soon, we ended up together.
[00:07:57.830] - Big Rich Klein
Very good. Did Did she mark you first or did you mark her?
[00:08:04.460] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
She marked me. Yeah, for sure.
[00:08:11.800] - Big Rich Klein
Go ahead.
[00:08:13.140] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, and we've been married for 35 years now.
[00:08:16.720] - Big Rich Klein
Wow, 35 years. That's awesome. Yeah. It's a good job. So then you're working in the trades and everything. How did you get into off road or cars, or besides having the pickup truck, the cowboy truck.
[00:08:34.230] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Well, back then, I had, like I said, the 79 Ford, and I heard about Azusa, Canyon. Some people may know that place. Back then, it was a wide open four-wheel drive place. You go up there, we'd be there all night. We would mudden and this and that. Well, this is a cool story. We were up there going in the mud, and somebody's telling us, Just go here. We'll pull you out if you get stuck, just go. And I didn't. I just started Fort Wayne. I didn't know a whole lot. Sure enough, I go in there, and then they're like, F you, we're not pulling you out, this and that. We almost got in a fight with them and this and that. Well, guess who it was? It was Jon Bunderant so we became enemy friends, I guess you'd want to say right then. And slowly, the more I went up there, we got to know each other and became like We're great friends. And we wheeled forever up there and together.
[00:09:36.150] - Big Rich Klein
Azusa Canyon hooligans.
[00:09:38.770] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, yeah. It was all nighters. It was fun.
[00:09:47.090] - Big Rich Klein
So Bondrant. That's hilarious.
[00:09:49.360] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. He had a Land Cruiser back then, a Toyota Land Cruiser, and he was a nut. And so it made me start wanting one. I started paying more attention to Land Cruiser. So I found one, bought one, started fixing it up. Me and him, we became friends. We started wheeling. Our big thing was we used to go up there when it was raining. So we would do river crossings, and we'd see how deep we could go in the river. I mean, we would be floating these things, and we set them all up for water. It was wild. We'd drive out the middle of the lake as deep as we possibly could. Good times.
[00:10:23.930] - Big Rich Klein
That's a great story. I didn't get that story when I interviewed John. Oh, yeah. So that's That's awesome. And from Azusa Canyon, and the truck, and then the Toyota, what was the evolution like?
[00:10:40.660] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Well, we went from that, and then he had told me about Running Spring's off road race or something like that. And we went up to Running Spring's. It was a mud and snow race. And we raced up there and had a good time, did really well up there. And then it just got my blood of racing. I never thought I thought I would be into it, and I was. And then I started building Land Cruisers as good as you could back then. And then in 94, 96, somewhere in there, John had told me, Hey, I heard about this thing called Rock Crawling. You want to check it out? Sure. So we went up to Johnson Valley, went to the bottom of Jack Hammer. I don't know how you found it, but there we were and we heard somebody in the canyon. We're like, What the heck? And we looked way up there and we see these Jeeps just bouncing super slow down. And we're like, What in the world is that? So that's where it all started. And then it got my blood going on that. And I built a land cruiser in my garage and competed with John, actually was spotting me in the 1999 war and rock crawling nationals with Bob Hazel up there.
[00:11:58.950] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
That was my very first event.
[00:12:00.640] - Big Rich Klein
Yep, with Bob Hazel.
[00:12:02.220] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah.
[00:12:03.830] - Big Rich Klein
He's living somewhere in South America now. Oh, really? South or Central America. Yeah.
[00:12:09.310] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, good. But he's been good. He was a nice guy. Yeah.
[00:12:14.740] - Big Rich Klein
So then how did you do it, that Warren Nationals?
[00:12:18.400] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I broke the... I finished, I think we did Wrecking Ball, believe it or not, back then. We went up Wrecking Ball and made it. But then I broke a Burfield because Burfields were the thing back then that failed constantly on land cruisers. And I think I fixed it. And then the next day, we went out to some rock pile in the middle of nowhere, and that was the second day. And I did all right. It wasn't anything special. I was learning. I thought back then bigger tires, bigger everything, because that's what was showing up there. But it was pretty much the opposite. You needed to be able to turn and keep low center gravity. Mine was not built that way.
[00:12:58.610] - Big Rich Klein
You built for ground clearance.
[00:13:01.370] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, exactly.
[00:13:03.140] - Big Rich Klein
So do you remember the windstorm during that event?
[00:13:08.330] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I vaguely do. At night?
[00:13:11.110] - Big Rich Klein
I do because I was in a tent.
[00:13:12.290] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, yes. Yes, I do. Actually, I was in a rented motorhome. I do remember that. Yes, we were all inside. I saw pictures of that come to think of it. Yeah, we all huddled down inside of our rented motorhome.
[00:13:24.380] - Big Rich Klein
I was in a tent with my son. He was in high high school, I believe, by that time. Yeah, high school. And we had to put our ice chest at the head of the tent, even though we were parked behind a truck, to try to, for a wind break, so the tent wouldn't slap us in the face. It was so windy out there that night.
[00:13:49.350] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
It's funny, you remember all these times like that. But if you go back a few years, you don't remember everything anymore because it's just those special moments, I guess.
[00:13:58.000] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah. The stories, that's where the Where he's come from, is those special moments.
[00:14:02.880] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Exactly. Yeah.
[00:14:03.940] - Big Rich Klein
So then who were some of the people that you became friends with after that event?
[00:14:13.610] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Shannon Campbell and John Curry. Trying to think, yeah, for sure it was those two. And nobody knew anything who I was or whatever. And I remember talking to Shannon and thinking, Oh, my God, I'm talking to Shannon and all this because he always had the pretty cars and the cool-looking cars. And he actually introduced me to Curry, and he said, Oh, you should sponsor this guy. He's good. I'm like, Oh, shoot. Okay. So anyway, they ended up helping me out. It all started from there. So Shannon has been one of my great friends forever. I talked to him last night on the phone. He's just a good dude.
[00:14:51.800] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah. So from that, did you jump right into Arca?
[00:14:59.060] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yes. Went from that to Arca with Ranch Pratt. And I was thinking it was a different name before Arca, but I cannot remember it. But yeah, we did that, traveled around. I think one of them was up in Johnson Valley again. I don't remember. I was going over in my mind trying to remember everything.
[00:15:23.130] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah, it was Johnson Valley. It was down there outside of Apache Junction in on upper and lower Bumbble Bee or whatever they call it. And then Cedar City.
[00:15:36.210] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, yeah. Cedar City.
[00:15:37.630] - Big Rich Klein
Because that was the one where we were all surprised at how many people showed up.
[00:15:42.910] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, that was crazy back then. It was different back then, than it is now at Rock Call, and it was like a big deal. Yeah. Yeah, and then the U-Rock started, and that was good. Traveled everywhere. I don't know how I did it. Me and my buddy that was spotting for me Bob Schwinn, and we talked, still we're really good friends. We're like, how the heck did we pull that off with working, building Land Cruiser, traveling? I have no idea how he did it.
[00:16:13.770] - Big Rich Klein
It's because we were... Everybody Everybody was younger then and had a lot more energy, and it became a passion.
[00:16:23.680] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
It was a passion. It was all I thought about in between thinking about trying to work and keep my family going on.
[00:16:30.800] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah, and to pay for it all, right? Everything. Exactly. Yeah. So then when you were... I'm not sure. I know that was the Warren Nationals, and then it became... Bob Hazel turned things into Pro-Rock.
[00:16:46.940] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Pro-rock, that's right.
[00:16:48.320] - Big Rich Klein
And then Arca started. Arca was the first series, which I just named the... It was like Farmington, Arizona, Cedar City, or maybe it ended in Farmington, anyway. There was four events, I believe, that first year. And I got involved. I got involved. I was at Warren National's. I was the club President up in Cedar City, and we were trying to help Ranch get into Three Peaks area there and help him with judges and everything like that, because most of those judges came out of Southern Utah that he had that first, second, third year. And then he joined And then, Craig Stump started U-Rock and Super Crawl. That's right. And then they combined. I don't know if you ever competed at any of our Cal Rocks events. We stuck. I did not. Yeah, we were Johnson Valley area, and then California, Nevada.
[00:17:50.340] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Right, right.
[00:17:51.960] - Big Rich Klein
So then competing at our rock, then U-Rock. And then, did you get into X-R-R-A?
[00:17:58.760] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I didn't. That's about When I was getting out, I won the Pro Rock Championship in 2004, and then I got out. I did my last ride in the car, and I had the single seat one, Shannon Billton and Cody Wagner bought it was Super Crawl in Salt Lake City in the Pro Rock that year. And the Super Crawl wasn't Pro Rock, but I won Pro Rock, went Super Crawl. I rolled super hard off the top of that manmade course, and then I was like, I'm because Michie was getting older, too, to start racing. Right. Sold everything, and that was it.
[00:18:37.700] - Big Rich Klein
Did you own one of the Cadillac Campbell cars at one time? No. The Rock Ability? No, you never did? Okay.
[00:18:44.100] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
No, I I went from a Land Cruiser that I bought and used to do a Sears Canyon and all that, just slowly fix it up, competed. And then I had Jason Pauley build me from Twister Customs, built me a great car. That was a really good car. Ls1 in it. That was the very first V8 LS1 ever to go in a car was mine. Car worked awesome. And then after that, I sold that to Mark Berger. Okay. Yeah. He ran that for a while. I don't even know if he still has it or who has it. And then, John Nelson came up with Tiny and started building it, and John Budner was going to drive it. And I was staring at it a lot. I I actually spotted for John the first race in that in, God, we were in Farmington, I believe? Oh, with Tiny? Farmington, yeah.
[00:19:38.590] - Big Rich Klein
When he pulled it out of the trailer and everybody was like, that'll never worked.
[00:19:46.020] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Exactly. That was it. And then, yeah, it was up in Cedar. Gosh, I think it was for me. And John Banner went up the first course and heard his back. And I was like, oh, no. And then John's like, you want to drive? And I'm like, sure. So I drove it and never even been in it. And that was pretty fun. I could climb anything. Anyways, after that, I started really eyeing that thing, taking pictures, measuring when they weren't looking, doing all the stuff that I shouldn't have done. Drew up a perfect, exactly what I wanted car on a paper and took it to Shannon and said, Here's what I want. And sat out there for a week, two weeks or whatever while he was getting it going. And I went with an Ecotec Turbo. And then, of course, everybody said, That wouldn't work. And that was a badass car. It did really good. Pulled it out of the trailer in Cougar Buttes and won first time out.
[00:20:41.980] - Big Rich Klein
And Nelson didn't think it would perform, correct?
[00:20:45.370] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, no. Right when it pulled out, John Nelson walked over and put his hands in his hips. He was all, That'll never work. Great. He's usually right on everything. And Yeah. So we had a great competitions back then. It was fun, fun, fun.
[00:21:06.880] - Big Rich Klein
And Nelson was quite the competitor, whether he was... He didn't start actually driving in the competitions until he built the Scrappers?
[00:21:20.470] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. He actually used to come. He would ride up on a motorcycle. I had no idea who he was. I always heard his name from Chabunner because they were friends. And he would ride up and sit off and just watch these rock calling events. I was like, Who is this guy? He's like, Oh, that's John Nelson. Never thought a thing about him. I knew he was into off-road racing and all this, but he was slowly clotting the baddest car ever made and came out with that thing and then put John in it. Back then, I was able to start sneaking into the shop. He'd let me in and looking at it. It was just it was unreal. I mean, it was so far ahead of the times. It was crazy. And got to know him off of that. John drove it, and then I had mine. And then Nelson started building even a better one, which was a craft, whatever he called it. And yeah, I just kept making things better.
[00:22:18.910] - Big Rich Klein
And you said that that car was that you had Shannon build. You ran it until 2004, and then you sold it to Cody Wagner?
[00:22:29.580] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, Cody bought it, bought my trailer, bought the car, just took everything. That was it.
[00:22:36.470] - Big Rich Klein
Totally yard sale, huh?
[00:22:38.210] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. It was time. I don't remember why it was time. I think Mitchell was getting older and starting to race, and he wanted to do his thing, and it's just couldn't do both. And I was gone a lot. We were traveling all over. So a lot of money, a lot of time. Family was getting a little older, so it wasn't the best idea anymore.
[00:23:03.290] - Big Rich Klein
And you were still working construction?
[00:23:05.600] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, I was working construction. Like I said, I started my own. My dad just upped and left in '96 and said, I'm moving to Arkansas. And I'm like, oh, boy, what do I do? I didn't have my license, anything. So I just hunkered down, got my license, and started a business not knowing a single thing about business. I was a great wood framer. I could do anything. I could frame, cut roof stairs. I did everything, but I didn't know the business ended it. So I had to learn really quick and the hard way because I had a family. And off we went and that was it. Started working, working, working Then, Michie got old enough to start racing and went that direction.
[00:23:50.180] - Big Rich Klein
What did you start him in?
[00:23:52.740] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
We started him in trophy carts and Lucas Oil off road racing. He actually rode with me at the Suboba Grand Prix when he was young. I was at, what was it, an 800, and he rode with me and got his feet wet there. And then he wanted to race his own stuff. So started him in trophy carts and we traveled. And that was crazy. Lucas all off road. And we did like two or three series one year. He did really good at it and got faster and faster and faster. And then he aged out at 15, I believe it was 16 right there. And he still wanted to race, but I just didn't have the money to put him in a pro buggy or a pro light or any of that. So I said, what do you want to race? He goes, I'll race anything. I'm like, man, I felt horrible because all his friends were racing. You know the Lucas oil stuff. So I said, okay, well, how about a Razor, something Polaris? And he goes, yeah, perfect. I'm like, okay, I got one. And we built it and started works racing and traveling around doing that.
[00:24:57.030] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
And that's when he really kicked in and got really fast, great driving. That was no joke. These guys were on it. So went from there, kept doing that, and then started desert racing. And Polaris picked him up, Greg Scanlin, got an eye on him from Joey D, and hired him in 2016, I believe, and off he went. Nice.
[00:25:27.880] - Big Rich Klein
So let's talk about your UTV racing. Okay. So I remember King of the Hammers, 2009. I think it was we put on the... Dave and Jeff allowed me to put on a UTV race, which was... They didn't think it was going to be anything worthwhile. They said, go ahead, do it. Just stay out of our way. So I found a day where they were empty. We set up a race, a little shorter course than what they did, but it was pretty gnarly for the first time. And we actually pre-ran it in a Razor, but it was all stock. And we didn't pre-run the desert sections. I just wanted to know if it could handle the trail. So we went up, I think it was Outer Limits. And that was quite the handful. And then did a couple of the other trails. I don't even remember which trails they were, but you did pretty damn good in that race.
[00:26:37.510] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. That was all new to me, too. I had done a lot of rock crawling, so that helped a lot. Not to completely thrash a car and tear it apart the first 10 miles. So, yeah, I won that race. There wasn't as many people. Some people say nowadays, well, there wasn't many people back then. Yeah, but we were also in Dino-race and dinosaurs compared to now, so it all equals out.
[00:27:04.420] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah, we had like 22 entries.
[00:27:07.350] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. I was in a 2008 Polaris Razor, and I was smart enough back then to keep it low. I bought like light, lightweight wheels. I think I put on like steel wheels, just crazy light aluminum stuff, and a little bit of suspension, built by one of John Butter and his guys, and thing held out.
[00:27:32.220] - Big Rich Klein
What I remember, there's a couple of things I remember from that race. First of all, I had estimated what time you guys would come in, and I had to run to the finish line because you guys came in about an hour and a half earlier than I thought you would. And we didn't have real good communications back then. It was like string in 10 cans And I ran to the finish line just as you guys were finishing. And then the other one that I remember is, I think Casey Curry came in third, but he drove the last five miles desert back in reverse?
[00:28:17.260] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, yeah. I think that might have been the next year. What was it? 2010, maybe. I don't remember for sure. I remember where he was broke. That's about it.
[00:28:28.140] - Big Rich Klein
One of the things that I noticed that you did when you raced hammers with the UTV is you didn't beat the vehicle up much. You used your winch and you became really proficient at knowing where you were going to winch before the race and being ready for each spot. Is that pretty much what you did?
[00:28:50.020] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, we did a lot of... If we would get the course the day before or whatever, we would try to go really look at it, walk it. I mean, that was what we've done every year. It's like, get super familiar with it, find winchrocks, do the whole thing. And I think that helped a lot instead of just jumping in a car that morning and going out. Even But back then it was a little tougher without GPS and all that. I do remember taking off. I don't remember if it was 2009 or '10. And we took off, and right away, I went the wrong way around the wrong side of the mountain. And then I figured it out, and someone else did it. We were all turned around. So from then on, I was like, oh, we got to get this together, and figure this out, and start doing a little more checking the course and stuff before the race.
[00:29:42.520] - Big Rich Klein
So how many years did you race King of the Hammers?
[00:29:48.330] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I raced 2009 till 2019, 10 years.
[00:29:54.030] - Big Rich Klein
And how many wins did you have?
[00:29:56.660] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I got it written down here. One, two, three, four, five, six. Six wins. Six wins and two podiums. So eight times on the podium.
[00:30:10.270] - Big Rich Klein
Eight times on the podium. That's 80 %. That's pretty damn good.
[00:30:14.560] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. And then Junior has won. I won in 2009, '10, and then Schuler beat us in '11. He had the 900 when it came out, and I had an 800, and we were leading all the way to the end, and then he just I'm out of motor dust at the end. I won 2012, '13, '14, '15. You want the whole rundown? Sure. I got it here. Yeah. '15. And then me and Blake Vandelew were dicing it out, coming down Jack Hammer, and I broke a I'm joint, and he ended up getting that one. Shannon Campbell won 2017, then Michie won '18 and '19. And then After that, it was Miller, Cheney, Cheney, Cheney, Cheney. So Cheney is sneaking up on me. There you go. But Michie did get second overall last year, so that was another good run for him. So We've got quite a few podiums.
[00:31:17.330] - Big Rich Klein
Is the winching still a thing, or is he- No. You guys just drive him now?
[00:31:25.140] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, their winching is not even... We do go out and practice winching in really bad spots, but normally in a race, you think a really bad spot is a bad spot, but you just figure it out real quick and get up it because you know it's going to kill your time if you have to winch. Our pre-runners, Our pre-runners, I know some other teams have really bad ass pre-runners, but our pre-runners are just pretty basic, so they don't climb as good as the race car. So if we know we can get up in the pre-runner, we know the race car is going up. So Cool.
[00:32:02.740] - Big Rich Klein
And what are some of the the sponsors that helped you out through the time, through those years?
[00:32:07.670] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, my gosh. Well, Walker Evans was first. Okay. I'll give them that. They've just been stood behind us forever. They're the greatest. Polaris. Gosh, we've had so many. I don't even want to piss anybody off by not saying. Super ATV treated us great through the years. And, shoot, I would have got my list out somewhere if I would have known, but I would love to at least tell everybody, Thank you.
[00:32:37.980] - Big Rich Klein
And back in those rock crawling days, let's talk about some of the events Did you go to the Vernal Arca event? Or it was U-Rock, I guess?
[00:32:52.360] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I did, yeah.
[00:32:53.980] - Big Rich Klein
And what did you think of that event?
[00:32:58.560] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
It was great. I I remember it was really hard, really, really hard. I messed up a little. I'll never forget on that course. I had a winch that could suck in my front end. And for some reason, the race started or the course started. And I remember I had my winch sucked in and we had some really hard climbs and breakovers, and I could not figure out why my car wouldn't work. And I forget who was spotting back then, didn't catch it either. So it made it a really tough day or until I figured out what was going on.
[00:33:34.100] - Big Rich Klein
What about... Did you hit the Super Crawl? You only did the one Super Crawl?
[00:33:44.030] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I don't remember if it was one or two, but it was Salt Lake City with the manmade giant climbs.
[00:33:51.870] - Big Rich Klein
What would you say was your most favorite event site or event that you ran?
[00:33:59.940] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Johnson Valley was fun because I knew it well. I liked Cedar City, Farmington. I would say Cedar City and Farmington were really probably the best. I like those rocks. But I also like Johnson Valley, which is a totally different rock, but I knew it.
[00:34:20.980] - Big Rich Klein
Right.
[00:34:22.740] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
So, yeah, those were the ones I remember the most.
[00:34:26.100] - Big Rich Klein
What about Farmington and those huge climbs and The first time you saw those, what did you think?
[00:34:34.870] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, it's crazy. I didn't like it. I'll be honest. It was pretty scary. And then I remember Rich Hudson or something on Farmington fell off a cliff, and I was following him. I was up next, and he went down like 30 or 40 feet upside down, and I was like, oh, no. Maybe I should just quit right now, but you figure it out and move on. But I liked the big climbs. They were fun, really fun, because I like a good challenge.
[00:35:05.310] - Big Rich Klein
And the climbs then were pretty much straight up big throttle assault?
[00:35:11.120] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, you just get back and hold on and give it all it's got, and hope you end up at the top. Some of the technical ones were okay, but dodging cones and this and that wasn't my funnest part, I should say. But my little buggy, the very last one was good at it, so that was made it a lot easier on me.
[00:35:38.200] - Big Rich Klein
What about manmade courses?
[00:35:41.440] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I hated them. That's one thing, too. I heard they're going to manmade at Super Crawl up in Salt Lake, and I ran it up there, and I was just like, this is not my thing. I wasn't into it.
[00:35:58.360] - Big Rich Klein
Right. So you didn't run the Phoenix event?
[00:36:03.500] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
No.
[00:36:04.100] - Big Rich Klein
Firebird. Okay. You were out by then.
[00:36:06.450] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. Like I said, Salt Lake, after the manmade course, and it was just getting later in my want to win and all the time. So that's when I got out. I was like, someone's going to get really hurt on these courses. When you fall 30 feet from the top, which I did, I was at the very top and went off the side. And luckily, they had dirt and hay bails or something there, I remember, and I landed on those. And I was like, All right, that's it.
[00:36:37.050] - Big Rich Klein
Because there's no forgiveness in concrete.
[00:36:40.360] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
No. Oh, no.
[00:36:42.710] - Big Rich Klein
You'd think there wasn't in Rock either, but there is in Farmington, the Rock is a lot lighter. Donner is a different story because it's all granite, but you didn't get a chance to compete there.
[00:36:57.710] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
No, it looked fun up there. I'll give it that. Yeah.
[00:37:00.880] - Big Rich Klein
We're going back in with We Rock near Donner, just about 10 minute drive away this year, this next year. So everybody's looking forward to that.
[00:37:12.030] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, that's good. Boy, the rock crawlers out there now are something else.
[00:37:16.140] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah, the technology has really gone crazy.
[00:37:21.440] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, we used to make fun of all the rear wheel steer, and now that's the thing. If you don't have a rear wheel, you're not going to win.
[00:37:28.760] - Big Rich Klein
Correct. We changed the rules so that there was no penalty for rear steer, and everybody went that way.
[00:37:35.740] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
That's good. I like that. Even though I didn't have a rear steer, I always remember the rules that they get penalized. And I thought, well, this is unlimited, so I'm not a real fan of it, but I'm not going to tell them.
[00:37:47.890] - Big Rich Klein
Right. I remember when John Nelson came to me and said, Hey, Rich, I've already talked to the other promoters, and they've all agreed that we need to allow water or something in the tires. And I said, You know, John, that's going to make the cars much more capable. It's going to make the cars more expensive, and it's going to make the courses more difficult, to have to go more difficult. And he goes, Well, water is free. And I said, Yeah, but going to to 40 spline and to the different metals and everything else that will have to get stronger. You're just not... 60 chrome dolly, 35 Spline stuff is not going to cut it. With water in the tires. And he goes, Water's free. And then he goes to me, he goes, Well, Rich, look at it this way. I'm going to put something to weight my wheels. And if I have to put $15,000 worth of tungsten welded to the inside of each rim, I'll be the only one that can do it.
[00:39:04.920] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah.
[00:39:05.480] - Big Rich Klein
And how fair would that be then? And I was like, damn it, Nelson.
[00:39:10.870] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
He was persuasive.
[00:39:13.150] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah, he was. So I went So we went ahead and accepted the water fact. And, yeah, the courses had to get more difficult. The technology really went crazy at that point, where everybody trying to go lighter stronger, stronger, and different power sources for that weight.
[00:39:37.050] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. John Nelson, too, to backtrack to him, he helped us tremendously with our racing. He built, Mitch, a car, a Polaris for work's racing, and it was the first single seat ever built. He made the cage single seat. He dialed that car in. It was a rocket ship. And he taught us a lot, a lot, He was a good dude.
[00:40:01.480] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah. I was really hoping to get an interview with him, and he was putting it off, and then he accepted and said, Okay, let's do this. And the day of the interview that morning, I got a call, and he canceled, didn't want to do it. And then wasn't too long after that that he passed.
[00:40:24.320] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah.
[00:40:25.000] - Big Rich Klein
It was a shame.
[00:40:25.610] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I'd really like- Sad, sad, sad. Some people I know he rubbed the wrong way, but if you were on his good side, you were gold. And we got lucky with him, and he actually liked us.
[00:40:39.680] - Big Rich Klein
I know him and Tracy were like oil and water.
[00:40:43.930] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, yeah.
[00:40:45.900] - Big Rich Klein
Or maybe gas and fire. They were pretty volatile at times.
[00:40:50.390] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. I mean, don't get me wrong, when we were rocking on, we were down that road. We weren't big fans of each other because we were competing, and trying to find that extra edge, which he always had. He had it figured out way more than I did, but I would figure out ways to try to beat them. But what a good dude. Sad he's gone.
[00:41:12.680] - Big Rich Klein
So who were the guys that you you'd love to compete against, and you'd preferred not to compete against?
[00:41:19.890] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, gosh. First would be John Bohnert, probably because he was a friend of mine, and it was just awkward. Sometimes we a little, I don't know, off towards each other because we were competing. I mean, it's a lot of money back then. You could win some good money back then. Right. And John Nelson, of course, when he was competing, the people I like or were scared of them beaning me? Which part are you talking about that I like or don't like?
[00:41:53.500] - Big Rich Klein
Well, the don't like, I'm assuming, is the guys that were the heaviest competition.
[00:42:01.880] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Oh, there was Jason Pauley, Tracy Jordan, Shannon Campbell. All those guys were really good. And there's a lot more. I can't remember all their names. I know their faces, but there were some crazy people. Chris Durham was a shoot. Remember him? Oh, yeah.
[00:42:22.320] - Big Rich Klein
You know what?
[00:42:22.750] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Back then, honestly, back then, everybody was good. It wasn't like there was people that weren't good. So any time someone lined up, you were like, we're going to probably do pretty good, but I got to figure it out and do it better.
[00:42:37.180] - Big Rich Klein
Right. Yeah. Do you miss those rock crawling days?
[00:42:44.040] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
I guess because I'm older, I don't because I don't want to get hurt. Back then, I did never even thought about it, thank goodness. So it made it fun. But now I don't miss it. I love rock crawling still. I love getting in a Polaris Razor and just like Johnson Valley when it's before King of the Hammers and Mitchell is going to race. My favorite is that week because I get to drive the shit out of the courses with him. Drive, I shouldn't say courses, but all the trails. We just try to cover every trail. So then when the course is released, whatever a day or so before, you know them all in your head, just start hitting those. But it's like the driving to me in the Rocks is still just really fun.
[00:43:32.700] - Big Rich Klein
That's awesome. And how old is Michi now?
[00:43:35.550] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
28.
[00:43:36.670] - Big Rich Klein
28. Okay.
[00:43:37.690] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
He'll be married in two months.
[00:43:39.950] - Big Rich Klein
Oh, he's getting married. Excellent.
[00:43:41.010] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. He actually just landed in Morocco just a few hours ago. He's a little traveler now. Races for Red Bull, so he travels all over now.
[00:43:55.850] - Big Rich Klein
Is he going to eventually do Dakar, you think?
[00:43:59.640] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, he's already done Dakar.
[00:44:00.920] - Big Rich Klein
Oh, he did? He's done Dakar? Oh, yeah.
[00:44:02.750] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Three times.
[00:44:04.260] - Big Rich Klein
I guess I missed that. Sorry about that.
[00:44:06.810] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. He's raced Morocco, Argentina, Dakar. I can't name them all, but he's done a lot of races internationally.
[00:44:15.770] - Big Rich Klein
Nice. And so what's on the future for for Mitch senior?
[00:44:25.030] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Well, try to retire someday, work, work until I can't anymore. I go to the river a lot, I love boating. I like going to Mitchie's races over here, the desert races. His shop's really close to my house. It's just a couple of miles. So go over there and bug them when they're in there. And that's it. I'm a granddad now, so we'll go guys over to our house a lot. He's fun. That's it.
[00:44:56.350] - Big Rich Klein
Sweet. And What would you say to somebody that is out there wanting to get into off-road, whether it's rock crawling or racing or whatever? What would be your words of wisdom or advice?
[00:45:16.060] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Don't give up and follow all the smart guys. Look at everything that the people that are winning are doing. That's what I've done, and Richie has done. I've taught them to do. But yeah, you just got to keep trucking, even when it gets bad.
[00:45:36.340] - Big Rich Klein
Because those that are winning, those that are winning have got something figured out.
[00:45:40.350] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yes. Pay attention to those who are winning.
[00:45:44.910] - Big Rich Klein
Perfect. Yeah. Well, I think we've covered a lot. Go, go ahead.
[00:45:50.050] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
You know, one more thing is be humble. Don't be a know-it-all. Listen, be humble. Nobody likes to know-it-all out there. That's for damn sure.
[00:45:59.680] - Big Rich Klein
Right. Be a good winner and a good loser.
[00:46:03.100] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Be a good winner. Yes, 100 %.
[00:46:06.050] - Big Rich Klein
That's hard to do sometimes.
[00:46:08.360] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, it is. You watch people that are doing well and they aren't very humble about it.
[00:46:17.690] - Big Rich Klein
That's a turn off. Yeah.
[00:46:19.530] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, for sure.
[00:46:21.530] - Big Rich Klein
That's why I never competed. Yeah. Yeah, I never competed in motor sports. There was other things that I competed in, and I was never a very good... I was probably a worse winner than I was a loser. I'd rub it in people's faces and things like that. Might have led to a couple of parking lot confrontations, things like that, because of my attitude. And I just realized that I'm not a competitor. I'm better off on the side that I chose, promoting and organizing, than I am Out there as a competitor.
[00:47:02.230] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Right. So what are you doing now?
[00:47:04.620] - Big Rich Klein
A semi-retired from the Rock Crawling. I've got a partner that's running We Rock Boots on the ground. In fact, this weekend is Grand Nationals in Farmington. But we're helping behind the scenes, organizing, getting things ready for the events, and still working with the marketing partners, that thing. We've got Four Low magazine that we publish, which is a print magazine, and only one of two still on the market. Crawl magazine is one of them, and then us. All the rest of the magazines went away because of motor trend and their change of philosophy.
[00:47:44.280] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Right.
[00:47:44.860] - Big Rich Klein
And doing the podcast, and working other people events. And then I'm on the board of Directors for the Off-Road Motorsports Hall of Fame, and also for the Rubicon Trail Foundation.
[00:47:58.540] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Wow, you're busy.
[00:47:59.890] - Big Rich Klein
Yeah, for being semi-retired, I seem to have a lot of irons in the fire.
[00:48:05.160] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah, that's not really retired.
[00:48:07.380] - Big Rich Klein
It's just not the physical work that I used to do.
[00:48:11.080] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Right, right.
[00:48:11.960] - Big Rich Klein
All the set up.
[00:48:13.790] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Well, I thank you for thinking of me still. I'm not sure.
[00:48:17.380] - Big Rich Klein
Absolutely. You've been on my list for a while.
[00:48:21.450] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Well, I appreciate that. Yeah, and I hope I... I tried to cover everything the best I could. I'm sure I forgot a ton, and sponsors. It's just hard to remember everything right now unless I had it written down in front of me.
[00:48:35.370] - Big Rich Klein
Absolutely.
[00:48:36.310] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Yeah. Thank you so much.
[00:48:37.820] - Big Rich Klein
And thank you, Mitch, for spending the time and talking about your life in rock crawling and racing. And I hope everything for the best for your family in the future.
[00:48:49.930] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
Thank you. Same to you. I appreciate it.
[00:48:52.680] - Big Rich Klein
All right. You take care, and I'll let you know when we release this.
[00:48:55.930] - Mitch Guthrie, Sr.
All right. Thank you again. All right.
[00:48:57.170] - Big Rich Klein
Take care. Bye-bye. Well, that's This is another episode of Conversations with Big Rich. I'd like to thank you all for listening. If you could do us a favor and leave us a review on any podcast service that you happen to be listening on, or send us an email or a text message or a Facebook message, and let me know any ideas that you have, or if there's anybody that you have that you think would be a great guest, please forward the contact information to me so that we can try to get them on. And always remember, live life to the fullest. Is a must. Follow your dreams and live life with all the gusto you can. Thank you.