Trail Guide Extraordinaire, Nick Cimmarusti on Episode 252

 Sometimes, you meet a guy and just know he’s the real deal. As genuine as they come, Nick Cimmarusti has carved out a space for himself in off-road. Whether you see him on the trail sharing his knowledge with others, or in the shop doing the same, Nick will never lead you astray. Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.

5:33 – “make sure you don’t leave the keys in the golf cart, or else, he’ll steal it!”  I was three years old 

11:31 – I got into auto shop, and then it was all over from there – it’s been all automotive from there             

18:09 – yeah, it was assault with a deadly weapon, battery with intent to do great bodily injury, and inciting a riot.

28:32 – that’s how my life’s been, as soon as I make something really nice, it gets destroyed

32:11– What came first – Jeepers or Barlow? 

38:50 – A lot of things happened in 2016 – Fire Academy, Certification testing and Emily Miller called.

49:27 – it’s a lot of overcoming being uncomfortable in the sand and figuring out what what you can and can’t do

56:52 – The story goes…I met Mike in the middle of the night under the moon to have him give me his wife’s pantyhose

Special thanks to 4low Magazine and Maxxis Tires for support and sponsorship of this podcast.

Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.

Transcript

[00:00:05.300] - 

Welcome to Conversations with Big Rich. This is an interview-style podcast. Those interviewed are all involved in the off-road industry. Being involved, like all of my guests are, is a lifestyle, not just a job. I talk to past, present, and future legends, as well as business owners, employees, media, and land use warriors, men and women who have found their way into this exciting and addictive lifestyle we call off-road. We discuss their personal history, struggles, successes, and reboots. We dive into what drives them to stay active and off-road. We all hope to shed some light on how to find a path into this world that we live and love and call off-road.

[00:00:46.530] - 

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[00:01:13.030] - 

Have you seen 4Low magazine yet? 4Low magazine is a high-quality, well-written, four-wheel drive-focused magazine for the enthusiast market. If you still love the idea of a printed magazine, something to save and read at any time, 4Low is the magazine for you. 4Low cannot be found in stores, but you can have it delivered to your home or place of business. Visit 4Lowmagazine.com to order your subscription today.

[00:01:39.360] - Big Rich Klein

My guest this week is Nick Cimmarusti. From Georgetown, California, Nick is the lead of the mechanics crew on the Rebelle Rally. He's also a trail guide and trainer with Barlow Adventures. Having grown up in Georgetown on the Divide in California and living close to the Rubicon Trail for most of his life, he's also an avid rock Crawler. Hello, Nick Cimmarusti. How are you doing today?

[00:02:06.170] - Nick Cimmarusti

I'm doing great.

[00:02:07.690] - Big Rich Klein

Good to hear from you. Yeah, it's really good to have you on the podcast. It'll be interesting to find out more about you. I think I know a lot about you, but it's all been within the last nine years. Yeah. I know we met prior to that, but we didn't really interact at that time. So let's Let's jump into this and see where it goes.

[00:02:33.510] - Nick Cimmarusti

Sounds good.

[00:02:34.740] - Big Rich Klein

All right. First question, where were you born and raised?

[00:02:39.370] - Nick Cimmarusti

I was born in Glendora, California, which is Southern California, LA County, and lived down in Southern California, mainly Redlands area, until I was six. Then we moved to Georgetown, California, and where I've been pretty much the rest of my 39 years.

[00:03:05.890] - Big Rich Klein

So you went from Redlands to Georgetown. How did that come about? We'll get into your You probably don't have a lot of memory from six or before, but what's the... A little bit. How did that happen?

[00:03:21.310] - Nick Cimmarusti

My parents owned a business. My dad's a flight instructor and an aircraft mechanic, and they had My parents had moved out of Southern California. Prior to me being born, prior to me and my sister being born, they lived in Bishop, California for a while, and they moved back to Southern California. We're looking to get out of Southern California again, and we We used to camp out of our airplane. We were camping out of our airplane, and they were low-key looking for a place to move. We had looked at Williams, Arizona. We spent a bunch of time up in Idaho. On our way back from Idaho, we stopped in Georgetown to get some fuel. My parents fell in love with the airport in Georgetown and decided that's where we were going to move. My dad moved up about a year before the rest of us and secured a hangar on the airport and built out a business there and rented a house, and then the rest of us followed a little less than a year later. They ran a business there at the airport for 22 years, I guess. That's how it transpired.

[00:04:39.860] - Big Rich Klein

Interesting, Idaho, back to Redlands, but go through Georgetown. That is a roundabout way.

[00:04:49.330] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. Yeah. Kind of airport hop and looking for cool little spots. They'd look at the sectionals and try to pick out some rural mountain They knew they wanted to be in pine trees, and they just picked out a bunch of airports that they hadn't been to. Georgetown happened to be one of them, and there was an opportunity with a recent build on a hangar that was available for rent, and they liked the community. And so that's just how it happened.

[00:05:25.540] - Big Rich Klein

Nice. That's awesome. You said you Do you remember a little bit prior to six years old?

[00:05:33.680] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, a little bit. At Redlands, they had a business on the airport that was a flight school and a aircraft maintenance facility. They also had the aerodrome, which was a snack shop, pilot lounge thing. One of my early memories is everybody on the airport, not everybody, but several people on the airport down there had golf carts. And I was three or four years old, and my mom used to tell people, hey, make sure you take the keys out of the golf cart if you're going to let them play on the golf cart, or else, they'll steal it. I'm like, oh, he's fine. Several occasions, I'd steal the golf cart and go drive it across the airport and beelined towards airplanes and people running after me, screaming to stop.

[00:06:24.190] - Big Rich Klein

That's awesome. So then your school years really then are up Georgetown. And Georgetown, for those that don't know that are listening to this, is pretty rural. It's what we call the divide, and it's between two rivers. It's a mountain range between two rivers, or two parts of a river, the American River, the Central and the South Forks, or the Middle Fork and the South Fork, I guess you call it. And it's like one of the avenues up to the Rubicon. So you move up there when you're six years old, your parents move you up there. Obviously, you didn't move yourself. And what was it like? How many kids were there? And what was it like Going- So my mom and dad have two kids, me and my sister together.

[00:07:22.410] - Nick Cimmarusti

My dad had a son from previous marriage, and he's passed on and didn't live with us. So me and my sister. Basically, we grew up on the airport at Georgetown. My parents' business was open seven days a week, seven o'clock, 7: 00 PM. We had a house, but most of the time we were living at the airport. We'd go home to sleep, but most of the days were spent there. We had a cool back room at the airport that had a couch and a TV and a kitchen and everything. We had a pretty good set up to be there. But basically, as a kid, I grew up on an airport that I had free reign of that had a campground and backed up to maybe 100,000 acres of forest service land with trails that went down into Canyon Creek. And so my motorcycle got worn out in Canyon Creek. And then as I got older and got cars, they got worn out in Canyon Creek and all that. It was a really cool place to grow up with a lot of freedom. In that time frame, people didn't worry as much so we could walk to town or ride our bikes to town.

[00:08:42.270] - Nick Cimmarusti

We just had a lot of free which was really great.

[00:08:49.380] - Big Rich Klein

I've not been to the Georgetown airport. Is it up towards Growlersburg?

[00:08:57.790] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. If you go past the shopping center there, you're going towards Growlersberg, instead of the left on Reservoir, you go right on Spanish Treviggans, and it's another mile or so out there. It's on a ridgeline. It's an intimidating airport to land at. The north end of the airport hangs over the canyon that goes down into Canyon Creek. A lot of people say it's like landing on an aircraft carrier, and it's on a ridge line. So it's a unique airport to land at. My parents used to give out a certificate for the first time you'd land there. And the old guy Bob O'Hara, that used to be an artist, had this cool animated certificate that you would get when you flew in that said, USS Georgetown. My dad's got a very swoopy, intricate signature, so it was very official when you landed there for the first time.

[00:09:59.210] - Big Rich Klein

That's awesome. Then did you end up learning to fly yourself?

[00:10:09.350] - Nick Cimmarusti

I think I was immersed in it so much, it was just mundane to me. I have an interest in it now. My dad's still a flight instructor. He still has a few planes, and so we keep talking about me getting my pilot's license. But in my younger years, it wasn't all that interesting to me. Cars and Then, motor cycles and things like that caught my interest a lot more because they just were things that weren't as commonplace for me. I would literally walk around the airport as a kid and people would be pulling their plane out to go for a ride and be like, Hey, can I go with you? I probably have as many hours in an airplane as a commercial pilot, not flying, but riding. But it just never really sunk the hook into me. By my high school years, cars were just so much more interesting for me.

[00:11:14.440] - Big Rich Klein

When We're going through school, what were some of the courses that interested you? Did you know what you wanted to do as you were going through school?

[00:11:28.070] - Nick Cimmarusti

No, I still don't.

[00:11:29.190] - Big Rich Klein

You still don't Yeah.

[00:11:31.770] - Nick Cimmarusti

I think my middle school years, I had an interest in computers, and I was leaning towards learning networking and programming and never really got into that, but that's what I was leaning towards because my friends were leaning towards that. Then I got into high school and got into auto shop, and then it was all over from there. It was all automotive from there. My first car was AMC Eagle. Oh, nice. Do you remember those? The first, the original crossover, right? Yeah. It didn't last very long. We got it for $75 and poured a few quarts of transmission fluid in it and drove it home and fix it up. I was driving it to go snowboarding and the heater core popped and I didn't know enough to stop and pull over. The It overheated and I put a hole in the piston and I never really fixed it after that. I actually just recently got it back and it's sitting in my yard.

[00:12:39.100] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, yeah?

[00:12:40.270] - Nick Cimmarusti

Nice. That one was short-lived And then I got a Bronco 2 that was lifted, and that was my car throughout high school. And looking back now, I was like, wow, that really wasn't as cool as I thought it was.

[00:13:00.970] - Big Rich Klein

So in high school, in that time period, you were mostly just into cars. Did you do any sports or any other activities?

[00:13:11.790] - Nick Cimmarusti

No, never really got into sports. As a kid, I did Little League, and soccer and things like that, but never played any sports in high school. It was pretty much all automotive all the time. Right.

[00:13:27.540] - Big Rich Klein

And as your When your parents were up there in Georgetown and you're growing up, what things did you guys do besides hang out at the airport? I mean, vacation-wise or travel, anything like that?

[00:13:43.890] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, we used to... So Family, we've got a decent-size family, and family has always been important. We used to travel to Southern California a couple of times a year. That was most of our family vacations. We're just visiting family in Southern California. On my mom's side, my great-grandparents had homestead a piece of property in Val Yurma, which is out on the north side of the San Gabriel Mountains, Palmdale, Lancaster, Lake Los Angeles area. It's high desert, really beautiful spot. We'd go out there and then we'd go visit my dad's side of family in Apple Valley and spend a lot of time there. Then my middle school years, I think I was in seventh or eighth grade, my dad bought a YJ. Our big thing, especially in the winter months, was every time it snowed, we were trying to make fresh tracks. I missed a few school days here and there because we were trying to make fresh tracks in the snow up to Uncle Tom's and stuff.

[00:14:47.830] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Back then before it was paved?

[00:14:50.680] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. Oh, yeah. I think they paved it. I was 17 or 18 when it got paved.

[00:14:58.370] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. That That was a sad day for me, or a sad year for me when they paved it.

[00:15:05.850] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. I remember when it was still... They paved the upper section first. They paved from Tom's to Icehouse first, and from 11 pines to Stumpy was still single-lane pavement that was all rutted out from the logging trucks. My dad and I had taken the tent trailer that we had up to Icehouse or Loon, one of those, and we were jetting back down to my mom's Explorer, and we hit that section of single-lane pavement, and it was like the worst whip section in Johnson Valley. We had to get two or three feet of air in the Explorer, and it walked its place sideways. We thought we were rolling it.

[00:15:52.410] - Big Rich Klein

You had the Bronco, too, through the rest of high school?

[00:15:59.140] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, pretty much. It lasted. I had it through high school, but I think I put three or four sets of heads on it. At one point, I was thinking I was going to make it a full-size Bronco and make the back come off. I broke the windows out and uncut the top off of it and never added any structure to it. So the floorboard started cracking apart. And I just I drove that thing until it wouldn't drive anymore. It had bad can bearing, so it sounded like a diesel.

[00:16:39.940] - Big Rich Klein

And what did you replace the Bronco with?

[00:16:44.540] - Nick Cimmarusti

Oh, I got expelled my junior year through fighting, and I started going to high school, or I started going to auto shop in Auburn at high school. That high school teacher sold me a Honda Civic that had been wrecked. I drove that for a while and I had a Zuzu space cab truck, and then I just kept replacing and replacing. I'd owned probably, conservatively, a few hundred cars by now. I just would run something until it didn't run anymore and then replace it.

[00:17:28.390] - Big Rich Klein

Let's expand on this expelled from your junior year in high school, fighting. I never would have guessed that you had gotten into fights. Or was it just one?

[00:17:43.280] - Nick Cimmarusti

Just one, pretty much. And it was stupid. And I picked up a two by four and came back and said, Hey, you're a big guy. I'm a small guy. And so the stick makes it even. He said, Oh, you're not going to me with that. Then I hit him with it to prove him wrong, and it turned into a big thing.

[00:18:06.230] - Big Rich Klein

So assault with a semi deadly weapon.

[00:18:09.790] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, it was an assault with a deadly weapon, battery with intent to do great bodily injury, and inciting a riot.

[00:18:17.440] - Big Rich Klein

Inciting a riot? What happened beyond the two of you?

[00:18:21.190] - Nick Cimmarusti

The cops had to get everybody going back to class. So not my finest moment. It's probably one of the better... I In one respect, it was a good thing that happened to me because in getting expelled, I went on independent study and I was able to finish... My high school career was not academically great until I went on independent study and I was able to just knock out credits and and finished with a much higher GPA and it turned into a good thing for me. I was able to start working quite a bit. I think it started me off with a really good work ethic that a lot of my friends didn't get to finish high school.

[00:19:07.160] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. So let's talk about work then. What was the first job you had Well, the first job I had was working for my parents at the airport, working on airplanes, washing parts, stuff like that.

[00:19:26.070] - Nick Cimmarusti

Menial things that they probably could have had done elsewhere or by somebody else much more efficiently, but they were trying to help me out. Then I've worked at a dry cleaner. I worked at a metal finishing place doing monetization. I worked all over the place. Then my parents closed the business closed right after September 11th, the year after September 11th happened, so 2002. And they wound up falling into doing satellite Internet and satellite TV install. So I went to work for them doing that for a while, too. And that was a really successful business for them, and they're still doing some of that today. But I did that for a while until it to different shops and stuff like that, doing automotive stuff, doing a lot of automotive work on the side. And then I opened... My dad helped me open Black Sheep off road. And so I had... That was in 2009, in the middle of the recession, I was like, Oh, I'm going to open an off-road shop. I figured out that nobody had money to spend on an off-road shop. I started doing general automotive repair also, and And that worked out pretty good.

[00:21:02.150] - Nick Cimmarusti

And had the off-road/automotiv repair shop for... I still have it, but it was my primary thing and then full-swing until 2020, in COVID.

[00:21:19.180] - Big Rich Klein

So that's where I think I first met you, was when you had your shop? Yeah. Was next door to Rogies, is that correct?

[00:21:30.290] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, that building's collapsed. Or Dawn now, it collapsed.

[00:21:34.610] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, really?

[00:21:35.980] - Nick Cimmarusti

Wow. Yeah. During the snow a few years ago, there was too much snow weight on top of it, and both those big commercial buildings collapsed. But yeah, I moved in there in 2009. I think Rogi moved in the year later, two years later, something like that. I moved out in 2012, I think, and moved into the shop is behind the auto parts store.

[00:22:03.100] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And yeah, because that same business area was... Dan Trout had his shop there in Rogi's spot after that. And then, I think it was Rogi spot. And then there was also, that's where pirate headquarters were, pirate 4x4. Yeah. Yeah. And was pirate going on at that time?

[00:22:27.090] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. I actually, I think I lifted I put the lift on Camo's excursion that we had, and I did a little bit of work here and there for them. Okay.

[00:22:39.900] - Big Rich Klein

Did you ever go to any of their parties?

[00:22:42.740] - Nick Cimmarusti

No. They were right at the tail end of what they were doing there. I think we were only in the same complex for maybe a year, year and a half, something like that. Okay.

[00:22:58.710] - Big Rich Klein

So then you're You go through all these miscellaneous jobs, not any real careers, and then you jump into a shop, and you jumped in during the recession. How did that all go? Was your clientele based there? Mostly in Georgetown?

[00:23:26.740] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, not all of it. I had one really good client I built a flat Fender Jeep for him that was pretty much all custom. It's a throttle down custom's frame and an Aqualoo body and curry axles. And we put a... We wound up putting a two-liter EcoBoost motor in it out of a Ford Fusion and stuff. That guy lived in Long Beach, and now he lives in Texas. We'll build another truck for him. But So that worked out to where I got some work from out of the area, but it was few and far between. So I started having to do general automotive repair locally because one thing that the recession did do was instead of going out and being able to buy a new car, people really started focusing on keeping up their cars so there was no shortage in general automotive repair to keep the commuters rolling. Right.

[00:24:35.210] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I get it. When did the Rubicon become important to you?

[00:24:47.520] - Nick Cimmarusti

Probably middle school, so 12 years old, something like that. My dad bought his YJ. When I was really young, my dad had a I had an early Bronco. I think it was like a 70, 71 Bronco, something like that. I remember it a little bit, but the YJ was the first Jeep that we had. We spent some time up on the Rubicon, and we spent a lot of time in the snow, but also exploring the entire Crystal Basin area and around Highway 50, Kybers, south of 50 out in that area. And so really got hooked on the Rubicon and stuff, really in high school. Tried to take my Bronco, too, up there several times. They were plagued with... They had a front... The front diff was aluminum And so you could just basically rip the pinion out of the front diff really easily. And so I ripped the front diff. There was front diff in that thing apart a few times. And then in I'm trying to remember. I think it was right after I graduated, I got a Suzuki Samurai, and that's when I started really getting up on the Rubicon a lot. I bounced around between I went regular.

[00:26:15.260] - Nick Cimmarusti

I had a couple of different Samurais. For a couple of years, I was wheeling a 73 F100 that was all cut apart and had a 390 and an MP435, so it had really good granny low, the Detroit front wear. I had a pretty nice four runner that I was really proud of this 4-runner and built it out really well, had solid axel, swapped it, had 529s and dual transfer cases with a 4, 3 gear set in one of them. It was just a really cherry four runner. The first time I took it out, I rolled it on devil's post file.

[00:27:01.620] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, no. Yeah. I had a square box Chevy. It was a '72' that was the guy that I got it from was... He had it painted, really nice, was working on the engine, had a small block 400 in it, and I got that thing from him, and I was impatient and didn't replace the tires before driving it. I mean, I was waiting for tires to show up, and I just got impatient and took it on the interstate in Utah between St. George and Cedar City, and had a front tire blow out and rolled it at like 75 miles an hour. And all I did was destroy the body, didn't twist the frame or anything, so I swapt bodies on it. But I was really sad because the thing was... I mean, the body was just really nice. And fiber glass hood with a Ramair-type intake on it, hoodluver-type thing. Then I went to ended up with a body on it from a '76 that was primed.

[00:28:32.250] - Nick Cimmarusti

That's how my life's been. As soon as I make something really nice, it gets destroyed. So I was leaving it at that 90 % mark.

[00:28:43.130] - Big Rich Klein

Luckily, I haven't wrecked my Raptor yet. I probably should have, but I haven't. So, fingers crossed. Knock on wood.

[00:28:54.060] - Nick Cimmarusti

There's a square body tire story reminds me, when I was in high school, one of my best friends was Neil Bratten, and he was I guess he was the R&D guy at rough stuff for a long time. He's a hell of a fabricator and hell of a welder. He used to live above Georgetown, and he had a square body Chevy. I think it was a '76, and it had a small black 400 in it, and it had a SM465. We found some tires his dad had, so we decided we were going to bolt those on and go do burnouts until they popped. We would go by Chiquita, and we were just dumping the clutch and burning the tires and burning the tires until they popped. Then we had flat tires, and we couldn't figure out how to get it back to the house. We're going to drive back on the rims.

[00:29:46.400] - Big Rich Klein

One other time when I was in high school, a friend of mine, Craig, we took his dad's, I think it was a 63. I think it was a 63 Impala. It may have been a 64, Tudor. And we were doing donuts in the parking lot of the high school at night and blew the rear end up. I mean, it just exploded. There was grease everywhere and parts and all that. So we pushed it. We grabbed the parts and we pushed it out of the parking lot and down the road, and then called his dad, took it down by a stop sign, threw all the parts on the ground, and then told Yeah, we don't know what happened. We just went to pull away and it just rear-end let loose. He didn't believe us, but he couldn't prove otherwise. I've tried that line before.

[00:30:39.290] - Nick Cimmarusti

I tried that line a lot of times. My dad asking why my mom's tires on her Ford Aerostar minivan are bald in the back. I don't know. Well, why is all this rubber stuck in the wheel? I don't know.

[00:30:58.770] - Big Rich Klein

Slick roads. Yeah. So then you moved into the shop in town, and you continue... Well, you still have that shop, correct?

[00:31:11.920] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. So my dad wound up with that building in a business deal. And so it made sense for me to move in downstairs. And it was pretty rough down there, so we did a bunch of work. And it served as a really nice shop for us. It's a cool location. It's right off the main street, so you're close to everything that's going on, but it's on the back side of the building. So not everybody's walking in all the time. And yeah, I still have it. I've been teaching classes out of it here and there, and I still do a couple of projects here and there and tinker on my own stuff there. But one of these days I'll build a shop at my house and probably move out of there. But until then, it's still a pretty nice shop to have So my next question is, how did you get hooked up with...

[00:32:05.870] - Big Rich Klein

What came first, Jeepers Jambourie or Nina Barlow?

[00:32:11.180] - Nick Cimmarusti

Well, I've been around Jeepers for a long time, and know all the Jeepers people. I went to high school with Lacey, all through school with Lacey. She's a couple of years older than me. But, yeah, I think as far as attending Jeepers and working for Jeepers, that was after Nina. So I started working with Harold Peachman, who used to do guided trips on the Rubicon. He started, I think, in 1987. He was a camel trophy guy, competed on camel trophy, and met Mark Smith. And Mark invited him out to the Rubicon, said, Hey, you got to come check out the Rubicon. And Harold said, Well, all I have is a G-Wagon, and I heard I have to have a Jeep. Mark said, That's bullshit. You should bring your G-Wagon. So he came to the Rubicon and decided that was a good spot and built a business guiding and touring on the Rubicon in the summertime and then spending his winters in Mexico, he's a German guy, so a German citizen. He had to spend a little bit of time out of the country. He split between the Rubicon and La Paz, and he would do some guided trips down in Mexico in the wintertime.

[00:33:38.890] - Nick Cimmarusti

When I opened the shop, I started doing his maintenance in the summertime or maybe not maintenance, but some of his emergency repairs between trips. He was running some TJs and old FJ40s, and it seemed like things broke pretty frequently on those. And I maintained things for him for a while, did a bunch of emergency repairs on the trail for him, tried to help out as much as I could. In 2013, he was at home in Mexico, coming off of his roof, like a little narrow staircase, coming down from the roof and fell off the staircase and wound up breaking his ankles. And Nina Barlow bought his business from him, and I guess I came with the sale of the business and started working for her. I think it was 2013 We did... I didn't start guiding for her, but I started doing her maintenance and stuff. Maybe that was 2012. I don't remember. I started doing her maintenance for the Jeeps, when she was there in the summertime, she ran the TJs that she bought from him for the first year and then brought JKs in the next year and still did all the work while they were there in the summertime.

[00:35:17.260] - Nick Cimmarusti

Then we did a couple of bigger events. We did the Top Gear, did an episode on the Rubicon, and I went along for support on that, and that opened I ended up more work with Nina, and I started helping guide trips, and then we started doing stuff where I started teaching basic off-road driving and recovery skills, things like that with her. She really encouraged me to follow that pathway, and I was not a very good public speaker. I was not good at delivering anything to anybody. She She challenged me into making that better, and that's snowballed into a lot of work with Nina. She and I are really good friends, and she takes very good care of me, and I do a lot of work with her now.

[00:36:15.400] - Big Rich Klein

Part of that encouragement that she was giving was getting your trainer's license?

[00:36:21.230] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. I think it was 2016, she said, Hey, you need to do this. It was the testing for certification process with the International Four Wheel Drive Trainers Association. That was a fun week-long testing process out in Moab. It's a very rigorous testing process where they run you through all these different scenarios and try to push you to your limits. A good majority of the folks involved are military military of some level. A lot of them are lots of military experience and just incredible amount of knowledge among all of them. It's a very It was a tough process and only, I think, about 20% pass rate. I think there was 11 people in my testing class, and two or three of us passed. I really enjoyed it. I felt like I was right at home suffering and dealing with crappy cars and all these things. My biggest problem was the presenting part and public speaking part. It still gives me jitters having to do that, but now it's more of a... I want to feel that, I guess, now.

[00:38:00.880] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, the adrenaline rush?

[00:38:03.240] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. Cool. At Rebell Rally, every year, I have to get up and talk in front of everybody during the rally school, and my hands are always shaking and everything. But once I get up there and talk, I'm fine. But it's the 10 minutes leading up to where I'm terrified.

[00:38:21.280] - Big Rich Klein

I didn't realize that. I'm going to have to give you a hard time now. You do a good Nice job. Thanks. Let's talk about that. You're working for Nina. You've got your own shop, you're guiding, you've got your trainer's license, and an opportunity comes up. How did that opportunity come up to work with the Rebell?

[00:38:50.780] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, so a lot of things happened in 2016. The testing for certification happened in 2016. I started the Fire Academy in 2016, and then Emily Miller called me in 2016 and said, Hey, Nena Barlow recommended you. I'm looking for somebody to come help me with this rally. She's explaining what it is and that we're going to need to provide mechanical support for this rally. I was trying to wrap my head around how that looks. I'm like, I don't know that I'm equipped for this. I was like, I have a Jeep and a Jeep trailer. I could throw some tools in and chase everybody around, but I don't know how effective that would be. She's like, What about a trailer? I was like, Well, I could rent a U-haul, I guess. That's what we did. We rented a U-haul, and we loaded all the things we could think we might possibly need into the back of that, and went and chased the rebel rally around.

[00:39:54.330] - Big Rich Klein

That first year, were you Were you at the staff meeting on the side?

[00:40:05.350] - Nick Cimmarusti

I missed the staff meeting. I got there late. I think the... I I'm trying to remember why we were late. We were late. And so I missed the staff meeting, but I did get there for tech inspection. And I think that was the...

[00:40:29.310] - Big Rich Klein

I'm trying to remember That was the year of the fire.

[00:40:31.440] - Nick Cimmarusti

Was that the year of the snow? Yeah. So fire, the snow, all that. I think we had to... I'm trying to remember if we had to build a hitch for the U-Hall that year or the year after. Anyways, it's always been crazy. Leading up to it, it's always been at least a month long process leading up to it to get ready. And that year I wrote all the mechanical rules and mechanical guidelines an event I didn't really understand. But Emily and I spent a lot of time on the phone trying to figure out what we needed. Chris and I spent a lot of time on the phone figuring out what made sense. We wrote the mechanical guidelines and all that, and then we showed up late.

[00:41:26.160] - Big Rich Klein

How many people did you have working for you that first one?

[00:41:34.480] - Nick Cimmarusti

I brought one of the guys that worked for me at the shop, and then Josh Mcworthy came as a recommendation from Nina. He worked at the dealership in Cottonwood, Oxendale, that did all the service on her Jeeps. He was a recommendation from her. Then I think the Hoens brought, sent a guy from Honda that worked at one of the dealerships, but he didn't come to tech. He met us at one of the later base camps. We had three, but not all the time, three.

[00:42:12.060] - Big Rich Klein

Right, because Josh ended up on course.

[00:42:15.290] - Nick Cimmarusti

On course, yeah.

[00:42:17.460] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. And what was the biggest repair you had that year?

[00:42:24.400] - Nick Cimmarusti

We had a lot of repairs, but the thing that took the most time across the entire rally was working on Terra trips, the rally computers, the odometers. They were just... Nobody knew anything about them, and they're very finicky. They're not a real robust piece of equipment. They took a... There was a huge learning curve. I think we were up 3: 00 in the morning still trying to install people's terror trips the night before rally school. I think the Porsche, that was the the Porsche K-N, we were trying to figure out some problems with the Terra trip, and they turned the ignition on while I was underneath it. We didn't have... It wasn't jacked up, but it wasn't on jack stands, and the air suspension to squat, and I was underneath it still. That was base camp one, and I did the rest of the rally with most likely a fractured rib.

[00:43:27.530] - Big Rich Klein

Wow, I didn't know that.

[00:43:29.720] - Nick Cimmarusti

Oh, Yeah.

[00:43:30.080] - Big Rich Klein

And then it- Couldn't breathe the whole rally. And then at Dumont, they blew out both tires on one side of the vehicle.

[00:43:38.760] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah.

[00:43:39.180] - Big Rich Klein

And then Sugar High.

[00:43:41.370] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. Dumont was a shit show. Everybody broke everything. Sugar High bent the front axel and broke out the back window and did some other damage. And so that was the big story repair for us was we found a new front axel, and Well, first I took that on the trailer, so it happened to Dumont, put that Jeep on the trailer, went to Hesperia because my uncle knew a guy that ran a body shop that had a frame machine, so we went and bent the axial back and they ran it for a day and it bent again because we didn't dust it or anything like that. And so it bent again. And so the next day, I was calling around frantically, trying to figure out what was going on. And I found a shop called Crawler Off-Road in Indio, and they built a Dana 30 real quick. And we swapped it in that night so that they could finish the rally.

[00:44:48.630] - Big Rich Klein

Right.

[00:44:49.770] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah.

[00:44:50.200] - Big Rich Klein

I thought that was pretty awesome for the first one.

[00:44:54.610] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. We've always been pretty good about trying to get everybody cross the line. It doesn't matter if it's the last day or anything like that. We definitely want to give them whatever they can get.

[00:45:12.470] - Big Rich Klein

So then, And next year, it expanded for you, didn't it?

[00:45:22.620] - Nick Cimmarusti

A little bit for us, yeah. That was the year we were like, oh, we ran out of space last year. Let's get a bigger U-Hall. And so we got a 24-foot U-Hall, which was a mistake because at the time, U-Hall was transitioning out of their GMC, like TopCick trucks. And so we got a truck that was just a royal piece of crap. And I had to build a hitch for it because it didn't have a hitch receiver and we were trying to tow my car trailer. So I had to build a hitch. And then by the time we got to Dumont, I We had repaired a bunch of stuff on the truck. I had to patch the radiator. We were babying the fuel pump because it was failing. And it made it... We nipped it into Yucca Valley and we were like, hey, we need a new truck. And all had were the smaller 17-foot U-haul. So we had to put everything from a 24-foot U-haul into a 17-foot U-haul. They weren't very happy that I built a new hitch for it. I had to unbolt that in their driveway and put their hitch back on.

[00:46:31.540] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, it was a rally within the rally.

[00:46:35.950] - Big Rich Klein

Right. But if all of us have a rally going on, depending on whether your teams, or if your course crew, or if your medical safety, if you're the mechanics, we have all scoring. We've all got our own rally that we're doing.

[00:46:58.970] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, I think you're Jeep's been on my trailer several times during the rally.

[00:47:02.820] - Big Rich Klein

I think it probably has more time on the trailer than any other single vehicle, except maybe the old Bronco.

[00:47:10.860] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, that one's been on the trailer a little bit, unfortunately.

[00:47:15.580] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, luckily, that old Cherokee is relegated to just trail use now.

[00:47:20.620] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah.

[00:47:22.860] - Big Rich Klein

So then you started doing training classes It started off more like for the Rebels, didn't it? Then it's just grown from there or what?

[00:47:40.260] - Nick Cimmarusti

No, actually, the training and stuff started before the rally. It morphed into Rebell Training because we were doing training previously. Then the Rebells, year two, we saw some training increase or some training interest from Rebells. I think year three and four were really the people started realizing, Hey, I can get a leg up if I take some training. But most of our training that we were doing wasn't Rebel Rally related at all. Then we just started seeing more interest. Now we do some Rebels' specific training and some Rebel-related training that we've partnered with Emily on some stuff. At the end of next month, in February, we've got our week-long and Glamish training that we do every year. It's coming off the end of the Rebell U training, so they'll have the opportunity to go do two days of Rebell U training with Emily and Chrissy, And then they come right into our training where it's a pretty comprehensive sand driving class and desert driving class with a full day of classroom navigation and everything. It's a pretty in-depth course that we've got built out.

[00:49:18.420] - Big Rich Klein

Cool. That's through Barlow, and how many people are involved in that on the training side?

[00:49:27.420] - Nick Cimmarusti

Well, it's six instructors there for that training. We'll probably have a couple of helpers, like teachers' assistance. To have me, Nina Paul, who will be the lead instructors, and then Mandy, Alex, I'm trying to remember who else. I feel bad, but I know they're six. I think Nicole Patel will be out there. It's It's normally a pretty good time and a lot of learning and a lot of overcoming some being uncomfortable in the sand and figuring out what you can and can't do, and that it's okay to get stuck and how to get down stuck, and all those things.

[00:50:19.240] - Big Rich Klein

I don't know how to get stuck.

[00:50:23.130] - Nick Cimmarusti

No, I'm very good at it.

[00:50:24.390] - Big Rich Klein

I'm going to knock on wood, but then again, I haven't. I've never had to go out into the middle of the dunes. Oh, yeah. Not into the deep areas of the dunes.

[00:50:39.510] - Nick Cimmarusti

I've been to every corner of those dunes in cars that shouldn't be there.

[00:50:43.370] - Big Rich Klein

Right.

[00:50:45.400] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. It's funny when the power wagon tow truck shows up at the swing set and all the guys in the sand cars and the Razors are like, what the hell is that doing here?

[00:50:54.520] - Big Rich Klein

That's classic.

[00:50:58.010] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. I drove my bone-stock Ford Ranger out there. That was fun.

[00:51:07.200] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, God. When's that, Rebellu, and the Barlow training?

[00:51:12.160] - Nick Cimmarusti

The Barlow training is the last week of February, and I think the first day of March. Yeah. Let's see. Yeah, so I think we start on the 23rd and wrap it up on the second. Nice.

[00:51:30.240] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. That should be a good time to be down in the sand dunes.

[00:51:33.700] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, it's normally pretty pleasant. We've done training there in August, and that's not fun.

[00:51:40.180] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, it's not pleasant. No. Hell, some of the times when we're there for the rebel, it's not pleasant.

[00:51:46.980] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, right. Yeah, I learned that firsthand. 115 degrees, my brain stops working.

[00:51:55.320] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah.

[00:51:57.490] - Nick Cimmarusti

We try to do a last minute sand training. Now we've got permitting for Sand Mountain by Fallon now. We do like September, get a last minute sand driving training in there before the rally. That's a little nicer in September than Glantis is.

[00:52:18.720] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, that's what Shelle and I showed up to your, you guys' training last year.

[00:52:23.450] - Nick Cimmarusti

Oh, yeah. Last year. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that was a good one.

[00:52:26.770] - Big Rich Klein

It was funny because we'd seen some people A couple of posts about being out at San Mountain, and it was like, we're not doing anything. Let's drive out there. It's only two and a half, three hour drive, whatever it is. Yeah. Yeah, it was fun.

[00:52:43.650] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. It was great to see you guys too. Got to help out with the Enduro practice.

[00:52:48.440] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, yeah, that's right. Yeah. So then, how did Michael... That's a good story. Why don't you talk about how Michael got involved with you guys in becoming a mechanic?

[00:53:03.420] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. Michael Schafer, he's my right-hand man now. I wish he lived a lot closer. He lives in Vegas, but he's probably one of my best friends that lives far away. His wife has competed since the beginning. She was in the Sugar High Jeep? Yeah, she was the navigator in the the Sugar High Jeep. The Sugar High Jeep bent the axel the first year. It was Michelle and Kevin Davis owned that Jeep. They were towing it behind their motor home in the off-season. And I don't know exactly what happened. When you're telling a Jeep, the transportation should be in neutral and the transmission should be in park or if it's manual in gear, so the transmission doesn't turn. And I think probably likely what happened was the transmission was in neutral, and an automatic transmission doesn't oil from the back, it oils from the front turning. And so if the engine is not running, it's not oiling. And I think the transmission overheated and it caught on fire. And so that fire melted the dash and all that. And so Kevin went through and built a custom dash for it out of aluminum. It looked really cool.

[00:54:26.410] - Nick Cimmarusti

And he's a detailer guy, an old-school hot rod and stuff like that is what he was into. He put autometer gages in the dash, and his thought process was, hey, I don't need all these sensors on the motor because the gages have their own sensors. He had got rid of the coolant temp sensor and some other things weren't connected on this Jeep, and it was just running like crap. And Andrew and Michelle had competed again and we were doing a lot, and the thing was running super fat. It was pushing so much fuel through the exhaust. Their eyes are watering and they can't breathe. And I'm going, what the heck is going on? So I plug into it I finally find the OBDT port to plug into it. It's throwing codes for not having the coolant temp sensor and a few other things going on. And I called Kevin and it's pretty common when I'm doing repairs on Rebell's vehicles, I enlist their significant other's help for the background of the vehicle.

[00:55:34.910] - Big Rich Klein

Because you know they've had their hands in it.

[00:55:37.290] - Nick Cimmarusti

Oh, yeah. I either background on the vehicle or I make them start calling around looking for parts, anything like at. So I called Kevin and he's like, Oh, yeah. I unhooked all that stuff. I pulled it out. We didn't think we needed it. And so it's like, Okay, well, it needs it. We were in Dumont, which is only a a couple of hour drive from Vegas, and Michael lives in Vegas. So I called him and it's late. It's dark, I don't know, probably 9, 10 o'clock at night. And I was like, Hey, I need all these parts to make this thing work. And So luckily, Vegas has some 24-hour parts stores. He picked it all up. And one of the things that was going on with the Jeep was it had an aftermarket air cleaner on it and an oiled air filter, which generally It wasn't very good in the dirt, and it was passing a lot of dirt into the motor. And I was like, Hey, we need a air filter, a cone filter, and a pre-filter. He's like, I can't find a pre-filter. I was like, Well, bring me some pantyhose, right? He wasn't allowed to come to base camp because he can't have outside people come into base camp.

[00:56:52.310] - Nick Cimmarusti

So I had to meet him in the middle of the night and away from base camp, a mile down the road. The story goes that I met Michael Schafer in the middle of the night under the moon to have him give me his wife's pantyhose. That's how we became friends. The next year, I don't remember if it was year three or year four that Michael came on, I was looking for some help. It's hard to find the right people that fit on the crew. There's a lot of people that are very skilled mechanics, but it's hard to explain what base camp is like if you're not there, but you know. It's hard to find the right people that fit. And so I invited Michael to come, and there was some really strict rules about him being there, if his wife is competing and all that. I don't know how I ever started out without him because all I have to do is call him, be like, Hey, Mike, I need this, and then I don't have to worry about it anymore. Or I can be working on one car over here. And this year we got split up.

[00:58:11.210] - Nick Cimmarusti

We had some big transitions on this rally where our crew was broken apart and I never even had to worry about what was going on with what he was taken care of.

[00:58:25.380] - Big Rich Klein

It's good to have that... The skilled and somebody that can think on their own and you don't have to guide. That's one of the things about the staff on the rebel. Is it everybody Everybody, especially nowadays, are problem solvers.

[00:58:49.890] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah.

[00:58:50.480] - Big Rich Klein

I don't care what part of the staffing it is. Everybody is very capable, thinks on their own, self-starters, will take care of problems when they see them, they don't even have to ask. They just do it, and it just works. It just works.

[00:59:09.990] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. They're all Swiss Army knife people. They have a little bit of everything. It's not like, Hey, this is my job, and this is my only job. It's any problem that comes up, any one of them could.

[00:59:27.820] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. The only one on the rebel pulls that card is me, because I'm Shelleys driver. That's it. That's it. Well, let's talk about you and your family. Immediate family, wife and kids. How long you been married?

[00:59:50.700] - Nick Cimmarusti

Married for almost 16 years. Next month will be 16 years. We've been together for 19, and My wife, Jennifer, we met here in Georgetown. She was the bagger at the grocery store. My uncle, who wasn't really my uncle, just really close family friend, had taken me to the grocery store before I was 21 to help me buy a bunch of booze. They had a shopping cart full of booze, and she came to bag all that, and I said, Oh, we're definitely going to need help out to the car with this. A couple of days later, I came back and got her phone number, and that's all she wrote. The first time, our first date was taking my dad's truck down to Canyon Creek and tearing up a bunch of mud and getting the truck all muddy and real red neck date.

[01:00:51.050] - Big Rich Klein

Right.

[01:00:54.030] - Nick Cimmarusti

But, yeah, we've been together for 19 years, and she's on the staff at the Rubelle also is a safety team member. She's an EMT, a firefighter.

[01:01:05.970] - Big Rich Klein

She's out of town right now.

[01:01:09.360] - Nick Cimmarusti

No, she's back now. She was in Southern California on the Palisades fire, but back now. We were looking at the Hughes fire yesterday to see if one of us was going to go out, but they didn't call. Then we have two kids Trenton is 15 and Allison is 13. They're both at the... They moved to the middle school to high school a couple of years ago. Allison is in seventh grade and Trenton's a sophomore, and he's working on his driver's license. He's got his permit now. Hopefully, he'll have his driver's license soon. He bought his first car all on his own. He's got a job. Nice. Got himself a 2004 Jeep Cherokee. That's pretty cool.

[01:02:05.830] - Big Rich Klein

2004 Cherokee? Oh, so it's one of the new- It's a WJ. Yeah, okay.

[01:02:13.860] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. Got a 4. 7 in it. It's actually a car that was owned by a friend of mine, and they bought it new, and I maintained it for years at the shop. Car We hooked them up pretty good on it.

[01:02:31.740] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. You got on to the fire department just recently this last year, I think, full-time. Is that correct?

[01:02:40.350] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. So I started out as a volunteer, went through the Volunteer Academy in That was in part due to leading Rubicon trips for Nina. I was like, Wow, if I'm out here with all these people, I should get some more medical I got a lot of experience, and the Volunteer Fire Academy offered an emergency medical responder course as part of the academy. I did that and got hooked and been pretty involved as a volunteer since then. Last September, I got hired full-time. I worked a bunch of fill-in shifts here and there over the last several years and had been part-time extra help and the opportunity came up to go full-time, and I took it. So far, I'm pretty happy with it. Really like it.

[01:03:37.710] - Big Rich Klein

Excellent. What's on the horizon for you?

[01:03:44.600] - Nick Cimmarusti

Right now, there's an 18-month probation cycle for this job, so I'm focusing on doing a good job there. One of the big reasons to take that job is the schedule is two days on and four days off, so I'm still working on stuff in the shop on my off days and doing a lot of training. Recently, in the last two years, I started doing mechanical training. So I teach an entry-level mechanics class, entry-level welding class, and then a couple of steps up from those. And so I really want to expand those classes and So take that out a little farther, make it a little more available to people. There's not a lot of opportunity to do a little bit of mechanical training. You You could go to auto shop in high school, you could go to a junior college and get some adult education classes, but you're committing to a whole semester. There's not a lot of opportunities for bite-size pieces. So I want to expand that. There's a lot of people that have mechanical knowledge, are pretty knowledgeable and can do a lot of things, but maybe they don't know how to do gear setups to do their wing and pinions.

[01:05:17.190] - Nick Cimmarusti

I'd like to do a wing and pinion class for a little more advanced class, stuff like that. But that's the big things that are on the horizon, is more of that, more of Bell. This year, This year, over the last couple of years, we've really grown the Rebell program. And Hens oil came on and Milwaukee came on and really helped us grow the mechanic program. And Rivian has really supported a lot there. Toyota has really supported a lot there with sending technicians. That program keeps getting bigger, which means it takes more time every year. So that'll be a big time suck this year, I'm sure, which is always fun.

[01:06:05.620] - Big Rich Klein

Well, and it's our 10-year reunion, too, or anniversary, I should say.

[01:06:09.850] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. Everything's going to break big this year.

[01:06:17.440] - Big Rich Klein

I wonder how many cars have actually done every year. Is it just probably Hohen, the Landrover?

[01:06:26.480] - Nick Cimmarusti

Oh, yeah. Yeah, that one's definitely been every year. That one broke big this year. We had to put high pressure fuel pumps in it in Glamish without our trailer. I don't know. Every year, the people stay the same, but the cars don't always.

[01:06:50.690] - Big Rich Klein

Right. I think Owen might be the only one. That's the only one-off probably.

[01:06:55.610] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, it'd be interesting to find out.

[01:07:01.470] - Big Rich Klein

Is your son interested and your kids interested in the Rubicon like you have? Are they going to follow in the footsteps?

[01:07:12.240] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, I think so. They've been going to the Jeep Jambury event, the second trip, the family event with Camp Rubicon since they were little. I do the medical support for jeepers, and so I drag them along on the family trip. I think as they get older and drive more, they'll get more and more into the wheeling side of it. But now it's the social aspect of going up there and seeing their friends that they don't see except once a year and being part of all the activities that the Jeepers puts out. That's a big thing for them. I just built them a Jeep. I've got a '95 YJ that I put on JK Axle with 513s and 35s and all that. They've got a Jeep to wheel around up there. I built that with the intent of laying and suffer a little bit on these springs.

[01:08:16.190] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, that's a good way to learn, though.

[01:08:20.670] - Nick Cimmarusti

Oh, yeah. It'll be fun for them. It's almost done. I think all I have left to do is bleed the brakes and put a water pump on it, and it should be good to go.

[01:08:33.540] - Big Rich Klein

Awesome. Well, nick, I want to say thank you so much for not only spending the time and talking about how you got to where you are today, but also for what you've done on the Rebell and what you've done for me personally. You've helped me out not only with the Jeep, the old black Beater XJ, but you come through and always find... You always take care of me, and I appreciate that. Anything I can ever do for you, all you got to do is call, dude.

[01:09:12.170] - Nick Cimmarusti

Well, I appreciate that. Thanks.

[01:09:14.810] - Big Rich Klein

And this is going to be a good year on the Rebell.

[01:09:19.330] - Nick Cimmarusti

I think so. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:09:23.150] - Big Rich Klein

Well, you have a great evening. Thank you so much for sitting and talking.

[01:09:29.240] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah. Thanks for having me on. I've been listening to your show for a while now, so it's fun to be part of it.

[01:09:35.550] - Big Rich Klein

Excellent. And I'll let you know that it'll air this Thursday, so a week from today. So get ready That's it. I'm happy for that.

[01:09:46.360] - Nick Cimmarusti

Awesome.

[01:09:46.950] - Big Rich Klein

All right. You take care and succeed at everything you do.

[01:09:53.880] - Nick Cimmarusti

Thanks, Rich.

[01:09:54.830] - Big Rich Klein

All right. No more fighting with the two by four.

[01:09:58.800] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah.

[01:09:59.810] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, one last question. Do you see that guy anymore?

[01:10:03.920] - Nick Cimmarusti

Yeah, we still live in the same town. We're all good.

[01:10:07.390] - Big Rich Klein

Okay.

[01:10:08.870] - Nick Cimmarusti

You know, small town stuff.

[01:10:10.390] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. All right. Sounds good. You take care. You too. Okay. Bye-bye.

[01:10:16.680] - Nick Cimmarusti

Bye.

[01:10:17.590] - Big Rich Klein

Well, that's another episode of Conversations with Big Rich. I'd like to thank you all for listening. If you could do us a favor and leave us a review on any podcast service that you happen to be listening on, or send us an email or a text message or a Facebook message, and let me know any ideas that you have, or if there's anybody that you have that you think would be a great guest, please forward the contact information to me so that we can try to get them on. And always remember, live life to the fullest. Enjoying life is a must. Follow your dreams and live life with all the gusto you can. Thank you.