Exploring the Off-Road Journey with Mike Ingalsbee in Episode 275

In this engaging episode of "Conversations with Big Rich," host Rich Klein sits down with Mike Ingalsbee, a seasoned photographer with a rich history in the off-road industry. Mike, the founder of Mike's Race Photo, shares his unique journey from growing up in Michigan to becoming a prominent figure in off-road media. 

Key Discussion Points:

• Early Life and Journey to California: Mike discusses his upbringing in Michigan, moving to Southern California, and the cultural adjustments he experienced.
• Entry into Off-Road Racing: A chance encounter at a Vegas race ignites Mike's passion for off-road racing, leading him to pick up a camera and never look back.
• Photography Career: Mike talks about his transition from being a team member to a photographer, highlighting his work with magazines and his role as co-founder of the Association of Motorsports Media Professionals.
• Memorable Experiences and Challenges: From navigating the desert terrains to the evolution from film to digital photography, Mike shares captivating anecdotes and insights from his career.
• Advice for Aspiring Off-Road Enthusiasts: Mike encourages newcomers to dive into the off-road world by taking initiative and following their passion.

Final Thoughts: The episode wraps with reflections on preserving the history and spirit of off-road racing, and Mike's aspirations for future projects and adventures.

Tune in to this episode for an inspiring journey through the lens of off-road adventures and photography!

Transcript

[00:00:05.100] - 

Welcome to Conversations with Big Rich. This is an interview-style podcast. Those interviewed are all involved in the off-road industry. Being involved, like all of my guests are, is a lifestyle, not just a job. I talk to past, present, and future legends, as well as business owners, employees, media, and land use warriors, men and women who have found their way into this exciting and addictive lifestyle we call off-road. We discuss their personal history, struggles, successes, and reboots. We dive into what drives them to stay active and off-road. We all hope to shed some light on how to find a path into this world that we live and love and call off-road.

[00:00:46.460] - 

Whether you're crawling the Red Rocks of Moab or hauling your toys to the trail, Maxxis has the tires you can trust for performance and durability. Four wheels or two, Maxxis tires are the choice of champions because they know that whether for work or play, for fun or competition, Maxxis tires deliver. Choose Maxxis. Tread victoriously.

[00:01:12.900] - Big Rich Klein

This week's guest found his way into off-road like many of us, from friends. But his path changed while at a race in Vegas. The visuals he saw that day led him into the media side of off-road. My guest is Mike Inglesby of Mike's racephoto. Com. Mike Inglesby. So good to have you on the podcast. Looking forward to this. You've got a rich history on the media side of off-road, and I'm looking forward to learning more about you.

[00:01:46.300] - Mike Ingalsbee

Thanks, Rich. I'm glad to be with you.

[00:01:48.800] - Big Rich Klein

So let's get started on the easiest question for most people to answer. Where were you born and raised?

[00:01:56.020] - Mike Ingalsbee

Well, that's interesting because I've been around a little bit. I was born in Michigan, a small town in Southwestern Michigan, where they actually make Chris-Craft boats.

[00:02:08.200] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, really?

[00:02:09.280] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah. So I grew up as a kid running around in the woods and climbing trees and doing all that crazy outdoor stuff. And then when I was 11 years old, we moved to California.

[00:02:25.800] - Big Rich Klein

At 11 years old, okay. And what part of did you move to?

[00:02:31.560] - Mike Ingalsbee

Southern California was a big culture shock for me, blonde haired, blue-eyed kid. And we moved into a Hispanic neighborhood. So I used to get harassed every day for being a surfer, and I didn't know what surfing was.

[00:02:50.280] - Big Rich Klein

I can understand that that might be a little bit of a conflict there, not knowing a surfer surfing at all.

[00:03:01.160] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, I remember walking to school in the morning and everyone was wearing down jackets, and I was in a T-shirt, and somebody said, Oh, aren't you cold? It's 60 degrees out. And I told him, 60 degrees in Michigan, we'd be running through the sprinklers with our bathing suits on.

[00:03:24.040] - Big Rich Klein

Exactly.

[00:03:25.100] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, it was really different. And then we eventually moved closer to the beach, and I became a surfer. So it was really cool.

[00:03:34.740] - Big Rich Klein

Those early years in Michigan, did you ever get over to the Chris Craft factory by chance?

[00:03:40.940] - Mike Ingalsbee

No, I don't think I did. It wasn't really on my radar then as a kid.

[00:03:45.500] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. I have a Chris Craft boat. That's why I had the interest. Okay. Anyway, so 11 years old, so you were right around sixth grade? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And a culture shock. Like you said, you go into a Hispanic neighborhood. What was the percentage of Hispanics to Anglos in the school that you moved into, school districts?

[00:04:15.560] - Mike Ingalsbee

It was pretty high. I remember having a... Flirting with a girl, and then everybody told me, Hey, her boyfriend, he wants to beat you up. So I was like, okay, well, I agreed to meet this guy after school, and he showed up and he was another white guy.

[00:04:39.900] - Mike Ingalsbee

We're like, wow.

[00:04:41.320] - Mike Ingalsbee

So we became friends.

[00:04:45.080] - Big Rich Klein

That's even better.

[00:04:49.060] - Mike Ingalsbee

So it was a crash course in different cultures. And as I got older and surfing, we used to go down to Baja quite a bit. So it was opened my eyes. If you're born into a conservative culture and everything, and you really don't learn much about the world until you start being around people from different cultures and seeing their perspectives. And I just I love that.

[00:05:24.480] - Big Rich Klein

Right. That is the case. I don't know if it's that you fear what you don't know or that you just don't understand what you don't know. Probably both. I know that in our travels, I found it very interesting how open people were to us. But we've gone to Mexico and Canada and Japan and Australia together. So I And we're not going to see a lot of different culture shocks there, except Japan was pretty interesting. But they were so open to us everywhere, except one little outpost in Australia I'll tell you, when I went in for a coffee and I asked for an Espresso Latte, and they gave it to me in this little tiny cup. And I said, Well, can you make something like 20 ounces? And the lady looks at the regular customers and goes, gluttonous Americans. And I just started roaring with laughter. I was like, really? Let me show you my wallet there, lady. Show you how gluttonous I can be.

[00:06:46.580] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah. It's funny, though, that the more you learn about different people from all over the world, the more that you realize that everybody's really the same. Everyone wants the same things. They want to have They want to have fun. They want to eat good food. They want the best for their kids and their friends and their family. So it helps to break down all these different preconceptions that I think are totally false. Right.

[00:07:16.720] - Big Rich Klein

And did you live in that same neighborhood all the way through high school?

[00:07:21.560] - Mike Ingalsbee

No, we only lived in that one Hispanic area for a couple of years.

[00:07:26.590] - Mike Ingalsbee

And then we moved down to, like I said, closer to the beach. And that's where I went to high school, and that's where I started surfing. And it was different. I surfed every morning. That was my PE class, physical education. And then I also was on the volleyball team. And my relatives back in Michigan, they just couldn't understand any of that. So they didn't know what surfing was. I told my I was on the volleyball team, and he just said, Volleyball's for girls. I don't understand.

[00:08:09.960] - Big Rich Klein

What community was that?

[00:08:13.220] - Mike Ingalsbee

Where I went to high school? Yeah. It was in Costa Mesa. Okay. All right.

[00:08:19.900] - Big Rich Klein

When you played volleyball, I think you and I are close in the same age. What year did you graduate high school? '79. '79. Okay, so you're a couple of years younger than me. Do you remember there was a player on the Olympic team, Eric Wurz? He was from that area.

[00:08:48.200] - Mike Ingalsbee

No, I'm not familiar with him, but it was ironic that we had an Olympic volleyball player that was one of the coaches on our team. Okay. His name was Bob Stafford. He was a setter. And I mean, the wealth of knowledge that he shared with us as far as how to play the game and the mental aspect of it, how you get in other players heads and things like that, it was really interesting.

[00:09:17.940] - Big Rich Klein

Awesome. I went to college with some guys from Southern California, and they were all volleyball players. And one of them, I mean, I was watching the, I think it was one of the Olympics, '80, maybe. No, it had to be after '80. '82 or '84. And I don't remember when the Summer Olympics were at that time. But they said, substituting for Karch Karai is Eric Wurz. And I'm like, holy shit, that was a roommate. Yeah.

[00:09:52.580] - Mike Ingalsbee

No, that name is very familiar to me.

[00:09:55.940] - Big Rich Klein

He was amazing. His brother played at Hawaii. He played at Santa Barbara, but he was a lot shorter than his brother, but he could out jump him. I couldn't believe how high he could jump. And like when we played basketball, he was getting his chin above the rim, and it was just amazing.

[00:10:23.560] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, that's something... I was always tall, so I told people I had to learn learn how to jump because I never had to.

[00:10:32.380] - Big Rich Klein

Right. That makes sense. Yeah. And so what student were you? Were you a good student or were you one of those guys that looked out the window wanting to get back outside?

[00:10:46.800] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, I was looking out the window the whole time. I usually started out having really good grades, and by the end of the year, they would drop because I just got bored. It didn't really go fast enough me. An interesting fact, my senior year of high school, they put me in a alternative program that I could make my own curriculum. So I was in there with most of the other students in there just couldn't deal with school. They were like the problem kids. So it was unique for me. And I just accelerated my learning. I was taking college level courses just because I was bored with the normal curriculum for high school.

[00:11:37.060] - Big Rich Klein

There was no challenge.

[00:11:39.320] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah. Back in Michigan, things were more education focused, I think. And once I got to California, I just really thought that there were a lot of things that they were teaching at the high school level that we learned in grade school.

[00:11:57.580] - Big Rich Klein

So what precipitated the move from Michigan to Southern California? Was your parents chasing jobs?

[00:12:11.040] - Mike Ingalsbee

My parents got divorced, and my mom had family out here on the West Coast, so that's why we moved. Okay.

[00:12:20.720] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. Makes sense. All right.

[00:12:22.400] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah.

[00:12:23.260] - Big Rich Klein

At that age, did Did you start off roading or how did you.?

[00:12:33.760] - Mike Ingalsbee

No. My first car was a Datsun 510 that I heavily modified, and I really enjoyed driving, and especially on the street. But it was frustrating for me. I had moved from Southern California up to the Silicon Valley area, and I had my 510. And on weekends, I would head out into the mountains. And it's just frustrating because I was on these mountain roads and wanting to travel 55, 60 miles an hour through the turns. And everyone else was going 35. So that, and getting tickets and such, I had some roommates up there, and they took me off roading in the Santa Cruz Mountains, and I loved it. I mean, I loved I love the freedom. I loved the challenge. I grew up in the woods, so I loved being outdoors again. And so I sold the 510, and I bought a CJ7.

[00:13:42.580] - Big Rich Klein

Okay.

[00:13:43.820] - Mike Ingalsbee

So That started my off-roading. And I used to tell people that I was rock crawling before it was cool because we would go on these trails that were just piles of boulders and such up in Santa Cruz Mountains.

[00:14:01.260] - Mike Ingalsbee

Really steep.

[00:14:03.240] - Mike Ingalsbee

The trail we used to do, it used to take us a couple hours, and it was less than a mile long, I think. But it had all these different challenges, real off chamber stuff, ruts. Sometimes it'd be a little muddy, and then there was a big boulder field. So it was really fun. We were up there almost every weekend out four wheeling.

[00:14:29.440] - Big Rich Klein

And did you move to Silicon Valley for a job? Is that for school? Yeah. Okay. For work. What work were you doing?

[00:14:38.680] - Mike Ingalsbee

Well, I was in manufacturing computer circuit boards.

[00:14:42.560] - Big Rich Klein

Okay.

[00:14:43.760] - Mike Ingalsbee

Which sounds boring, and it was. But in high school, I wanted to be a marine biologist. And I looked into it and everyone told me, well, there's no jobs. You're going to end up teaching for the rest of your life. And I was like, wow, I can't wait to get out of school.

[00:15:07.420] - Mike Ingalsbee

I don't want to be in school the rest of my life. So a friend introduced me into that, the manufacturing part of it, and I went to school to learn all the different processes. And so I eventually went up to Silicon Valley, and it was a really well-paying job and everything like that. And it was interesting. But the problem was, even on the weekends, everyone would sit around and talk about circuit boards. I thought, man, you guys are crazy. Do something, go out, have fun. Instead, they would talk about work. So I got burned out on that. And eventually I moved back to Southern California, and I went to school to learn automotive restoration.

[00:15:56.920] - Big Rich Klein

Okay.

[00:15:57.960] - Mike Ingalsbee

So I loved cars, and I to work on cars again. So I came back down south, and that's when I got introduced to off-road racing.

[00:16:08.480] - Big Rich Klein

So you still had your CJ7 at that point?

[00:16:11.280] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yes. And I eventually sold that and bought a Nissan hardbody four-wheel drive. But that's another story. I've gone through a lot of cars in my life.

[00:16:25.960] - Big Rich Klein

And you said you went to school for auto restoration. Was that through a community college or was that a specialty school?

[00:16:37.200] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, it was through a community college. My teachers were all old-school guys from the '50s, so we learned all the traditional techniques, metal finishing, letting, things like that. And we got pretty heavy into making our own body panels and metal working and things like that. So it was real fascinating, and I really love doing that work.

[00:17:07.320] - Big Rich Klein

And how did that lead into the off-road racing?

[00:17:12.600] - Mike Ingalsbee

Well, I had a friend who had an off-road car, and he kept on telling me, Oh, you need to come out to the desert and go to one of my races. You'll love it. And I was like, The desert? I mean, why would I want to go to the desert?

[00:17:29.440] - Big Rich Klein

So You were a tree guy.

[00:17:31.440] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, a tree guy and a beach guy. And I'll never forget it. He told me to come out to one of his races, so I finally agreed. I drove out to Las Vegas and showed up. And I never found him. I never saw him. But the minute I saw off-road racing, I just was hooked on it. That was it. I mean, I just couldn't believe how cool it was.

[00:18:01.640] - Big Rich Klein

And what did you do at that point? I mean, after that, you didn't get to find him?

[00:18:08.180] - Mike Ingalsbee

No, I just saw. I watched the race and then I came home. And then through other friends and acquaintances, I was on a couple of teams, and chased, and did prep, and things like that. But then I hurt my back, so I couldn't I couldn't change spares anymore. I couldn't bounce around. And that's when I picked up a camera.

[00:18:36.820] - Big Rich Klein

And that was just one of those flashes like, Oh, I'm going to do the photography now.

[00:18:44.880] - Mike Ingalsbee

Well, I always had an eye for it, and I wanted to be involved in the sport, but I knew it wouldn't be working on the cars or anything like that. So as Actually, I have to give credit to to Robbie Gordon.

[00:19:04.660] - Big Rich Klein

Okay.

[00:19:05.780] - Mike Ingalsbee

He's the one who turned me into a photographer. I was out watching a race in Vegas, and there's these hills out there by by prim.

[00:19:19.060] - Mike Ingalsbee

And I was parked my car on top of the hill, and I was watching the race, and there's a big silt bed down there.

[00:19:25.580] - Mike Ingalsbee

And I'm watching Robbie come along, and he's going the silt.

[00:19:30.790] - Mike Ingalsbee

And there's a helicopter 10 feet off the ground, flying sideways, filming him.

[00:19:37.780] - Mike Ingalsbee

And as the silt came off the back of his truck, it was getting caught in the prop wash from the helicopter and these big spirals of silt behind him.

[00:19:47.140] - Mike Ingalsbee

And they flew flying sideways, and they went underneath me because I was up on this hill, and I just started screaming. I mean, that was the coolest thing I ever saw. And I looked around, and there was nobody there but And I thought, wow, somebody needs to share this. Somebody needs to take photos of this.

[00:20:06.700] - Mike Ingalsbee

So that's when I decided I was going to do that.

[00:20:10.860] - Big Rich Klein

And you went out and bought a camera, or did you already have one?

[00:20:15.760] - Mike Ingalsbee

No, went out and bought a camera. And I had a friend of a friend who was a journalist, and he was my mentor, teaching me how to shoot photos and things of that nature. So... Yeah, that original camera was a film camera, and it had on it a motor drive, which means I could take three frames per second.

[00:20:43.540] - Mike Ingalsbee

Right. Nowadays, I don't even know how fast they go.

[00:20:51.540] - Big Rich Klein

True. So what was that first camera? Was it a Nikon or a- No, it was a Canon.

[00:20:57.940] - Mike Ingalsbee

And then that, I've stuck with Canon ever since. I guess a lot of people do that, their first camera, they stick with that brand. So it was a Canon A1.

[00:21:08.000] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And after watching Robbie, you go out and get that Canon A1, and what was the... Were you just itching to get out to the next race?

[00:21:22.800] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, I went out and shot photos of another Barstone race, or a race in Barstow, I mean. And I got my photos developed and I brought them over to my mentor, and he's looking through them and he's going, oh, no, oh, this is bad. And I'm like, bad? I thought these are really good. And he's all, no, they are. They're excellent. He goes, that's why it's bad. He goes, because next time you're going to go out and you're going to get a bunch of garbage and you're going to wonder what happened. So it's... I was good at it right off the bat, but still, I look at my early work now and it was really crude. And I mean, I had a hard time just keeping the car in the frame.

[00:22:17.260] - Big Rich Klein

Panning is an art form in itself.

[00:22:22.800] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah. And then also, I mean, I We've been to all different kinds of races, drag racing and track racing stuff on the street.

[00:22:37.840] - Mike Ingalsbee

But when you're standing out there in the desert and there's no actual track and there's no garden, hard rails. It was terrifying at first.

[00:22:51.360] - Big Rich Klein

And what did you learn, say, that first couple of races, what not to do?

[00:23:00.480] - Mike Ingalsbee

Oh, I don't know. I mean, stay out of the way, definitely. So I have a strong sense of self-preservation, so I don't think that was really a problem.

[00:23:13.760] - Big Rich Klein

That's a good That's a good problem to have with self-preservation. I can remember Josh England, the guy that was working for us, he was navigating at KOH one year, and they're coming up into this hard corner, and this Bush moves, and he realized that there was a photographer in a gilly suit on the outside berm of the corner, where everybody, I mean, within like three feet of where everybody was driving.

[00:23:47.000] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah.

[00:23:47.660] - Big Rich Klein

And he just, he called in right away to Race Ops and said, hey, get that guy off the track, gave him the location and stuff. But it's amazing what people will do.

[00:24:00.000] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, that's really stupid and foolish. I mean, a lot of times the guys in the race vehicles, they're not going to see you anyway. You can be wearing fluorescent pink, and they're so focused on what they're doing. They're not looking for you in the bushes. To them, that's just noise. They've got tunnel vision. So it's up to the photographer. It's up to anybody who's When you're there watching a race. You need to keep yourself safe. No driver wants to hurt anybody or hit anybody, but they're focused on their racing, and it's up to you to stay out of the way.

[00:24:45.580] - Big Rich Klein

Right. And that's one of the things that amazes me about races in Mexico, especially, how people want to touch the cars as they go by. Yeah. Zoo Road is is named... It's not because there's a zoo out there of animals. It's the craziness.

[00:25:07.900] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah. No, I'm just against that. I mean, I don't want to die. And I don't know if it's just bravado, or ignorance, or a combination of both.

[00:25:24.880] - Big Rich Klein

So as your time as a photographer and doing doing racing and everything. I'm going to jump into this real quick. You're the co founder of the Association of Motorsports Media Professionals?

[00:25:38.880] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, that's a group that a bunch of us put together to deal with safety issues and things working with the sanctioning bodies and the media. And we were hoping that once they understood what we did, that we would have a little more our autonomy as professionals to do our jobs because so many of the rules that were coming down were foolish. They weren't treating us as the professionals that we were. We spend hours and hours and hours on the race course, watching vehicles, seeing what they do, reading the terrain. That's a part of our job is to understand where the action is going to be and what the cars are going to be doing. So it's frustrating for us with these just generic blanket rules that really didn't have any basis in reality.

[00:26:47.220] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Especially in the United States. Yeah. Because BLM gets involved, and they make these, okay, well, you can have these media spots here, here, and here, and they're not where where you want to be.

[00:27:01.420] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah.

[00:27:02.740] - Big Rich Klein

And it's terrible.

[00:27:05.520] - Mike Ingalsbee

That's what happened in short course racing, actually. That's what got me really frustrated with short course and why I stopped shooting short course because they just didn't have any respect for the photographers. I would take time off work to go scout the track and set up photo positions, and then I'd show up on race day and somebody somehow would change everything. Some of the decisions were just absurd. I got fed up with the whole thing and stopped shooting short course. Okay.

[00:27:45.660] - Big Rich Klein

Let's talk about where your work has been seen, magazine-wise, that thing.

[00:27:54.280] - Mike Ingalsbee

Well, it's changed. A lot of my cohorts are into commercial photography. They have clients, and they get paid to go to races. And I was always editorial. So magazines, websites, things of that nature. And that's how I got into writing as well. I mean, I've always jumped off the cliff and then risen to the occasion. So when I started submitting photos, they would eventually always ask me, well, can you write? So of course, I said yes.

[00:28:38.840] - Big Rich Klein

Because you went through an English class or writing class in school, right?

[00:28:43.320] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, I did a lot of that. So I don't have a degree in writing. I just started writing. I mean, that's how you learn everything. I mean, back in those early days, I mean, off road racing, guys would build a car in their garage, and they'd learn how to race by going out and racing.

[00:29:04.800] - Big Rich Klein

Right. There were no racing schools in off road.

[00:29:07.980] - Mike Ingalsbee

Right. So I think anything's possible, you just have to put your mind to it.

[00:29:14.380] - Big Rich Klein

And Is there a particular race that sticks in your mind that has your favorite race of all time working it?

[00:29:28.600] - Mike Ingalsbee

Oh, I don't know. So many. I mean, it's just individual experiences. I mean, it's all... I don't think there's a single one. I mean, as far as scenery and photography goes, I mean, it's hard to beat the Silver State Race just because you get to see so many unique things. There's water crossings, there's silt beds, there's incredible terrain out there in Nevada, but certainly Baja is special. I mean, short course races. I mean, Crandon. Crandon is just an amazing experience. I mean, there are so many things and so many experiences, I mean, especially when you're shooting in the desert. I mean, it can be blistering hot or freezing cold. I remember a race in Lucerne Valley one year, back when we were shooting film, and our film kept breaking because it was so cold out.

[00:30:37.800] - Big Rich Klein

Wow.

[00:30:39.000] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, it would go to wind the photo and the film would just break. So Yeah, it definitely builds character. That's what we'd always say.

[00:30:50.720] - Big Rich Klein

So did you shoot in slide or in negative form?

[00:30:57.220] - Mike Ingalsbee

Just regular negative. So slide was very expensive.

[00:31:00.840] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, very true.

[00:31:04.560] - Mike Ingalsbee

And back in the day, it started out as a hobby. I did it part-time, and then eventually I transitioned into full-time. But really around 2000, I think I even said, well, that's it. I'm not going to do it anymore. There was no money in it, no profit, certainly. And so I quit shooting for a couple of years. And then I was at work, my day job, and my boss said, hey, I got one of these new digital cameras. And I'm like, digital camera? What's that? So, yeah, instead of shooting on film, it just writes it to this little card and you plug it into your computer. I was like, Wow, that's the secret right there. There goes all the overhead of getting stuff developed and being able to, what we call, chimp, which is look at the screen and see what the photo was that you just shot.

[00:32:00.700] - Mike Ingalsbee

So I mean, back in the old days of film, you never knew what you got until you had it all developed and you can lay it out and look at it.

[00:32:09.620] - Big Rich Klein

So, right.

[00:32:11.620] - Mike Ingalsbee

Kind of revolutionized photography.

[00:32:14.920] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I used to go to the Imsa GT races along the Coast and at various tracks. And it was the same thing. I had a deal with Nikon in San Francisco, Nikon of America, and I could go in there and basically borrow any camera and lenses and stuff that they had available. And you'd burn through so many rolls of film in a weekend. And the digital really made a difference. I got out of the photography business when it started to go digital because I realized at that point, everybody became a photographer.

[00:32:59.580] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah.

[00:33:00.000] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. Or at least a picture taker. Yeah. Yes. Whether they had the eye or not.

[00:33:07.840] - Mike Ingalsbee

There's a difference between a picture and a photo.

[00:33:10.600] - Big Rich Klein

Yes, correct.

[00:33:12.680] - Mike Ingalsbee

No, I know. But it also opened up a lot of creativity, because in the old days, every time you would push that button, it was 25 cents. So now it's like, I tell people that they ask me about photography. Well, what do you do? How do you get involved in photography? I said, well, go out and learn all the rules and then go out and break them. And that's how you be creative. Right.

[00:33:39.760] - Big Rich Klein

There you go. So did you ever do photography? You said you didn't do the commercial end of it, you did the editorial. But did you ever work for any teams?

[00:33:52.140] - Mike Ingalsbee

Very limited. One of my day jobs was for FAB Tech, and I shot for them off and on. And that's a funny story. It was frustrating. I would try to shoot Sean Giordano, and I'd come back from the race and he'd go, Oh, did you get any photos? Good photos? And I'm like, no, no, I didn't get any good photos at all. And a couple of races went by, and I finally realized what it was, was that he was a really fast driver. So every time he'd come around, he'd be in somebody's dust because he'd be making a pass. And I finally told him, you're too fast.

[00:34:40.560] - Big Rich Klein

You're too fast.

[00:34:42.880] - Mike Ingalsbee

But no, off and on, I might have shot for a couple of teams, but I basically focused on editorial.

[00:34:51.680] - Big Rich Klein

And talk about some of the editorial work that you did.

[00:34:57.560] - Mike Ingalsbee

Oh, I don't know. I mean, I worked for Different magazines. Kind of an interesting story from how I got discovered as far as photography goes. But I was in Costa Mesa at a camera store, and I had some enlargements printed out. I was sitting there at the counter and the owner of the store, we were looking through the photos, and he was like, Oh, that's a good one there. Oh, yeah, I like that one. And there was another shopper in the store and he came up and he started looking at them and he saw, wow, those are great. He goes, have you ever thought about contributing to a magazine? And I just looked at him like, well, yeah, that's what everyone wants to do. And it was Michael Summer from Hot VW magazine.

[00:35:52.280] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, nice.

[00:35:53.460] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah. So the first magazine to publish me was Hot VWs. And interestingly enough, I shared a buy-line with Judy Smith, who I think is the greatest.

[00:36:08.220] - Big Rich Klein

Awesome.

[00:36:09.760] - Mike Ingalsbee

So I started at the top.

[00:36:12.960] - Big Rich Klein

I would imagine that that's... Yeah. And so besides Judy then, who do you... Were there any photographers that you looked up to in the Oh, yeah.

[00:36:31.400] - Mike Ingalsbee

Early in my career, it was Bill Thompson from Carrera. He, I thought, was the best out there at that time. And I learned a lot from him, and he's still a friend to this day. And there were others, mostly my cohorts or whatever. I mean, Jason Zandrowski, Vince Knackle. There are a bunch of them out there. Art Eugenio. We all pushed each other, I think, over the years to be better and better. And I think the people who've been out there for the last 10 or 20 years, I think, are the the most creative and the best technically advanced photographers that I've ever seen.

[00:37:21.420] - Big Rich Klein

And you're still shooting today?

[00:37:25.980] - Mike Ingalsbee

Not as much as I used to. I keep saying, boy, I really want to get out But it's a young man's game. It's really physically demanding, especially in the desert. And it takes a lot of resources unless you have good clients and some money coming in. It's real expensive. It beats the crap out of your vehicle and yourself and your gear. And it takes quite a commitment.

[00:37:55.900] - Big Rich Klein

So speaking of that, when you were out there shooting, What vehicle did you move around the course area in or on?

[00:38:06.340] - Mike Ingalsbee

Well, back in the day, I had a '79 Chevy Blazer. That was really good. I used that as a chase truck Before I shoot, shot photos, I had that truck. I built a two-wheel drive pre-runner, and that's the last two-wheel drive I'll ever build. Part of our deal was going out to the tough spots, the silt beds, the really challenging terrain. And two-wheel drive is great while you're moving, but the minute you stop, sometimes you're stuck. So I learned my lesson, if you're going to travel out in the middle of nowhere, you better have four-wheel drive.

[00:38:53.800] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Or do like some guys do, and ride a motorcycle, which that's inherently got problems on its own.

[00:39:02.200] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, yeah. Because at the end of the day, when you're just beat, tired, I wouldn't suggest being on something that tips over easily.

[00:39:11.540] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Me neither.

[00:39:13.380] - Mike Ingalsbee

But plus, there's the whole thing where if you're out in the desert, you have to bring everything with you that you're going to need: clothing, food, water, supplies, camera gear is heavy, and you're out there all day subjected to the weather. So it's pretty challenging in that aspect of it.

[00:39:36.830] - Big Rich Klein

So obviously, you have shot the Baja-1000s?

[00:39:43.780] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, I did some in Baja, but back in the day when I was shooting in Baja, it was an expensive commitment of time and money, and I didn't see a return on it. So I focused on the Stateside racing.

[00:40:00.000] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. Because I was going to ask, doing the 1,000, was camping out on course, that thing?

[00:40:13.340] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, that was all part of it. That was all the fun. I mean, when I was on a race team, we raced San Felipe every year. And it was a funny deal as we would go down and stay at Pete's camp, and we would just sleep on the ground on the trailer and one of the palapas. I mean, we didn't have all the fancy camping stuff that we have now. No internet, no phone, even. But yeah, I remember in particular, one time we were in Ojos, I think it was for the 500, and we camped out and we had to drive into our spot the night before. Otherwise, the only way was on the course. And these guys showed up, and all night they had their music blasting and they're drinking beer. It pretty much made it miserable for everybody that was there. And then the morning rolls around, and we all get up, and these guys are all passed out on the side of the course with a pile of empty beer bottles, right? And the trophy trucks start, and we're all, Oh, this is going to be a harsh awakening for them, right?

[00:41:36.140] - Mike Ingalsbee

So they start rolling by, and here these guys are, a couple of feet on the course. They never even woke up.

[00:41:45.680] - Big Rich Klein

That's commitment.

[00:41:47.420] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, I think somewhere I have a picture of a trophy truck going by, and all you can see are these cowboy boots in the foreground.

[00:41:58.580] - Big Rich Klein

That's crazy.

[00:42:00.000] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah.

[00:42:01.580] - Big Rich Klein

So you are a 2022 Ormhoff Impact Award winner. What was that like for you, to be recognized?

[00:42:15.260] - Mike Ingalsbee

It was pretty...

[00:42:17.460] - Mike Ingalsbee

It was cool. I appreciated it. I liked it. I was flattered. There are several people that were nominated, and then one gets the award, I guess, voted on by the people.

[00:42:32.920] - Big Rich Klein

There's a people's choice, but everybody that's announced is the three finalists or whatever.

[00:42:38.620] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah. Yeah. Of course, I spent my time in competition, and I wanted to win that. But I was against... One of the other ones nominated was Austin Fish Farner, which I'm like, Okay, he's a shoe in.

[00:42:58.080] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, he's very, very well known.

[00:43:02.340] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, everybody loves fish. And I really, as a person of the media, I really respect the work that he's doing now with his reports and everything. I think he does a fantastic job.

[00:43:16.750] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, Fish just sticks. He's amazing.

[00:43:19.400] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah. So that was fine. I mean, that's the one thing. If you're competitive and you lose to somebody who's really at the top of their game, it's not so bad.

[00:43:31.260] - Big Rich Klein

Right. I agree. So I've seen you at the Ormhoff Gala a number of times. What do you think of the whole process and the Hall of Fame?

[00:43:45.980] - Mike Ingalsbee

Well, one of the things I'm a little biased because I work for Nora, and I've worked for Nora for about eight years now. And Ed Perlman created the Off-Road Motorsports Hall of Fame. And so Nora has strong ties to Ormoff. But I really, through my work as a journalist, I've been so fortunate to interview a lot of the pioneers of the sport and to hear their stories and how incredible things were. And I just really, I'm glad there's somebody to preserve that history and to share it with new people. My heroes like Bobby Farrell, Johnny Johnson, people like that. To hear... Johnny Johnson told me a story one time where he was racing It was the middle of the night and his car was overheating and he saw this light off in the distance. So he heads for the light and he pulls up and it's a little taco stand and they're closed and they're doing dishes, and he runs in there all dirty. And I mean, he must have scared the bejesus out of those people. And he sees a big pot full of dirty dishwater and beans and everything floating in there. And he grabs it and runs out and fills his radiator up and then runs back and thanks everybody.

[00:45:22.820] - Mike Ingalsbee

And they're laughing and waving, and then he takes off again. I mean, that's just so cool.

[00:45:30.000] - Big Rich Klein

That's Baja.

[00:45:31.480] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah.

[00:45:32.740] - Big Rich Klein

Stories like that are amazing. Yeah. Any others that you can remember?

[00:45:40.160] - Mike Ingalsbee

Just lots of them. Lots of stories about early racing in Baja and how it was and things that I've come to know over the years. Like going to Crandon was a huge experience for me. I've only been able to do it once, but it was just incredible. It's just something totally unique from everything else. And then I remembered reading that they started those brush run races because they had seen the Nora, Mexican 1,000 on TV, and they just thought it was cool. And they're in Wisconsin. And what are we going to do? We're going to race through the woods. So it's just really cool how everything ties together.

[00:46:29.280] - Big Rich Klein

Right. And are you still... I know we talked about doing photography, and it's a young man's game now. Do you still do anything with Nora?

[00:46:44.640] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, I do all their writing and everything. So I write their press releases. And then during the races, I do the daily reports, which means I sit here in the States and all I do is compile information all day. And then overnight, I'll write a release or a story on what happened that day. We have some great photographers down there who submit their photos and we put it all together. And then each morning, we put out a story on how the race went. And nowadays, now, we also have a live feed that they do from the race, which getting better and better every year. And it's just amazing with the technology, what they can do. And the livestream from the Mexican 1000 last year was just incredible.

[00:47:46.080] - Big Rich Klein

It's amazing the technology and what people are figuring out how to use it, especially Starlink. It really has been a game changer.

[00:47:56.500] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah. Well, they I had a couple of really intriguing stories. I guess it was this year's 1,000 Race. But Brent Fox was out there in his 6,100 truck, and he was leading and just having a masterful race. And then typical of off-road racing, he suffered some problems, so they had to change the transmission. And so he was behind and he lost a bunch of time. He was trying to make up-time. He and PJ Jones had a mishap, too. So the in-car camera from Brent and from PJ Of them going 110 % trying to make up-time. I mean, that was some of the most incredible footage I've ever seen. I'm trying like if I'm driving and it's like, okay, I would have gone off into that tree right there. It was just really cool. And Starlink has been amazing as far as bringing that action to the people. And if you remember, that's always what I wanted to do from the very beginning was to just share it with the world.

[00:49:16.840] - Big Rich Klein

And what would your advice be to somebody that wanted to get started in the off-road industry, whether it's as media or whatever?

[00:49:29.520] - Mike Ingalsbee

Just do Do it.

[00:49:30.720] - Big Rich Klein

Just do it.

[00:49:32.060] - Mike Ingalsbee

Yeah, just go out and do it. I mean, if you want to be on a team, there isn't a team out there that will turn down help. Show up, show up and work and you'll find a spot. The same with the industry. If you want to be involved in that, then just go and do whatever it takes to make that happen. I mean, I learned when I left manufacturing computer circuit boards and got more into the automotive stuff, it's because that's what I love to do. So if you really want to do something, just go out and do it. I mean, I know that's a tired phrase, but it's true So are you completely retired now, or are you still working a day job? No, I would call myself semi-retired. So I work for Nora and a couple of other clients, and that's about all I do. So I always want to do more and want to get out more. But the off-road journalism is in a lull right now, I would say. I think it's in a weird transition. For years and years and years, everyone told me, oh, print media is dead. And I would say, but now it seems that way.

[00:50:57.480] - Mike Ingalsbee

We had some earthquakes in the in the whole journalism world.

[00:51:03.320] - Mike Ingalsbee

And I think everything's trying to figure out where we're going to go now.

[00:51:08.940] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Our magazine, 4LOW, we We're taking it digital. We're not doing print any longer. And I hated to do it, but it was just time between our ages, the amount of time it to do the magazine and the return on it. It just didn't make any sense anymore.

[00:51:40.440] - Mike Ingalsbee

It's the same as when I transitioned from print-film to digital. It's that overhead of printing it on something. You can't get that back. So it's too easy to just post it online somewhere.

[00:51:55.800] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, exactly. Well, what's next, Mike? Do Have you have anything on your bucket list or life list that you want to accomplish?

[00:52:06.340] - Mike Ingalsbee

Well, I'm...

[00:52:09.260] - Mike Ingalsbee

Now I'm in a phase where I have all these automotive projects laying around, and I'm trying to get some of them done because I'm tired of them living in my brain. So I want to make those into the actual flesh. And ultimately, I've been on, on again, off again, building like an overland vehicle. I want to be self-contained. And that, I think, would be one of the keys to getting out there and shooting more photos. Because shooting great photos is about being in the right place at the right time. And if you're self-contained, you can go wherever you want. That's a big key in being where you want to be.

[00:53:03.780] - Big Rich Klein

True. Very true. Mike, I want to say thank you so much for spending the time and talking with me and sharing your history and your perspective on all things off-road photography. And I really appreciate it.

[00:53:23.360] - Mike Ingalsbee

Well, thanks, Rich. I appreciate everything you do.

[00:53:27.020] - Big Rich Klein

And I look forward to the next time I see you. Hopefully, we'll see you at least at the gala this year again, and maybe we can even share a table.

[00:53:37.180] - Mike Ingalsbee

Great. That'd be great.

[00:53:39.180] - Big Rich Klein

All right, Mike, you take care and you have a wonderful day. Thank you.

[00:53:42.840] - Mike Ingalsbee

You too.

[00:53:43.520] - Big Rich Klein

Bye, Rich. Okay. Bye-bye. Well, that's another episode of Conversations with Big Rich. I'd like to thank you all for listening. If you could do us a favor and leave us a review on any podcast service that you happen to be listening on, or send us an email or a text message or a Facebook message, and let me know any ideas that you have, or if there's anybody that you have that you think would be a great guest, please forward the contact information to me so that we can try to get them on. And always remember, live life to the fullest. Enjoying life is a must. Follow your dreams and live life with all the gusto you can. Thank you.