Robert Keller — From Mud Trucks to Rock Crawling on Episode 332

Robert started in mud trucks around 1998 with coworkers in South Florida. Progressed through multiple vehicles: K10 Stepside on 38-inch Groundhogs, a Jimmy, and eventually a YJ and square-body GMC truck. Attended his first Ultimate Adventure in 2015 (the last pay-to-play year) and was accepted to subsequent trips. Discovered passion for genuine rock crawling rather than mud bogging.

Adventure Wheelers East
After feeling disconnected from the Florida Adventure Rigs group, Keller partnered with Jack Sloan to merge their communities into AWE – Adventure Wheelers East, combining adventure seekers from multiple off-road networks. The group runs annual week-long wheeling trips throughout the Southeast, attracting both media legends and newcomers. Keller emphasizes accessibility: "It might not be the hardest wheeling you've ever done, but it's going to be fun."

Transcript

[00:00:05.320] 

Welcome to Conversations with Big Rich. This is an interview-style podcast. Those interviewed are all involved in the off-road industry. Being involved, like all my guests are, is a lifestyle, not just a job. I talk to past, present, and future legends, as well as business owners, employees, media, and land use warriors—men and women who have found their way into this exciting and addictive lifestyle we call off-road. We share their personal history, struggles, successes, and reboots. We dive into what drives them to stay active in off-road. We all hope to shed some light on how to find a path into this world that we live and love and call off-road.

[00:00:46.600] 

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[00:01:13.510] - Big Rich Klein

On this week's episode of Conversations with Big Rich, I'm talking with a friend of about 4 or 5 years that was born in northeast Missouri, outside of the Hannibal area, but as a kid of about 6 years old, moved to Florida. And there he got into mud trucks and eventually got into more of the trail-type Jeeps after having a number of different types of trucks that he's built. He's still really a full-size guy. He has participated in at least 3 Ultimate Adventures and then decided to start his own group of adventures along with a guy named Jack Sloan, who is a past interview that I did out of West Virginia. And they started the AWE, the Adventure Wheelers East. My guest is Robert Keller. All right, Robert Keller, good to have you on the podcast. Um, looking forward to finding out more about you than just AWE. So, and anybody that's wondering what AWE is, that's Adventure Wheelers East. I met Robert on a trip back east, um, to go wheeling, and, uh, an interesting guy to say the least. So Robert, how you doing?

[00:02:36.820] - Robert Keller

Oh, not too bad, Rich. I'm, uh, well, I guess I'm glad to be on your podcast.

[00:02:41.560] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, this will be good. I'm, I'm looking forward to this. So let's start at the beginning where I start with everyone. Where were you born and raised?

[00:02:50.390] - Robert Keller

Well, I was born in Northeast Missouri, uh, just outside of Hannibal, Missouri, if you're familiar with that. Oh yes, a lot of Mark Twain stuff based out of there. But I was only there until I was about 6 or 7 years old, and then we moved to South Florida in Palm Beach County, where I lived in Palm Beach County from the time I was in about the, uh, 4th or 5th grade all the way to graduating. And I was in that area until about 2005 and then moved to where I am now up in Central Florida.

[00:03:32.740] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And, uh, do you remember much from Northeast, uh, Missouri? I know Hannibal really well. We used to put on rock crawls there.

[00:03:41.780] - Robert Keller

Um, somewhat, believe it or not, because we used to go back quite often. Uh, my dad still has a farm there that he inherited from his dad, which would be my grandfather. And, uh, I'm still fairly familiar with it because there was Hannibal Rocks. This is probably where you're talking about back in the day. Yep, yep. And I remember a little bit up there, and I go back occasionally. And of course I have cousins and everything up there I go and talk to, but Most of my address growing up would be Palm Beach County and then later Central Florida.

[00:04:13.260] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And, um, why did he— why did, why did the parents up and move from Missouri?

[00:04:20.930] - Robert Keller

Uh, farming got bad in the '80s.

[00:04:22.880] - Big Rich Klein

Okay.

[00:04:24.300] - Robert Keller

So, uh, they ended up— my dad ended up quit farming. We actually had a small stint where we moved to Jefferson City for like a year. Okay. Which is the capital of Missouri there. And then we moved to Florida where him and another individual opened up a John Deere lawn and garden place in West Palm Beach. And that's where we went because he got out of farming because the whole 1980s farming kind of went to bust there. Right. Before ethanol. Yes. And I believe interest rates were really high and everything else. I mean, I was obviously a little kid and don't really remember all that, but That's kind of the gist of why I understand why we got out.

[00:05:08.300] - Big Rich Klein

So in those early years then in, in Florida, West Palm Beach, you said, right? Yes, West Palm.

[00:05:20.200] - Robert Keller

We actually lived outside of there in Royal Palm, which is just a little, little west of there, but same basic area.

[00:05:28.250] - Big Rich Klein

What was, uh, what was that like growing up in the, in the '80s there?

[00:05:35.650] - Robert Keller

Um, well, seemed pretty normal to me. I mean, I was just a typical kid that went to elementary school, then middle school, and got on my bike and rode way too many miles and didn't have any way to contact anybody. Nobody knew where you were, and it's just kind of what we did, right?

[00:05:53.740] - Big Rich Klein

I was a little— I was a, you know, before you in growing up, but same thing. The late '60s, early '70s was, I mean, I grew up outside of San Francisco, but used to ride the buses up to San Francisco and we'd go hang out, me and my friends, you know, when we were, you know, I mean, let's see, 6th, 7th, 6th, 7th, and 8th grade, or 7th and 8th grade, I had braces on my teeth. And my mom worked at UC Medical Center and got a deal through the medical center for taking me to see, to in there to see an orthodontist. To, uh, there was a school of orthodontistry. So we got, since she was a state employee and worked there at the hospital, got really good good, uh, prices on it. So that's where I would go. But I'd go up there, you know, by myself, get on the bus and ride it up to basically Golden Gate Park. Yeah, you know, you wouldn't even allow— you wouldn't even think of your kids doing that kind of stuff nowadays.

[00:07:04.540] - Robert Keller

Uh, no, but you know, not to get in a whole nother rant, but sometimes I wonder, everybody's like, oh, there's all this bad stuff going on. But I really think it was always going on, just nobody knew about it because You know, it was just, it wasn't in the local newspaper or local news. You didn't know anything was going on. Right. Yeah.

[00:07:21.640] - Big Rich Klein

There were neighborhoods in San Francisco that we, we tried to avoid as kids. I mean, I had to kind of ride through one of them to go to Giants games, but, uh, you know, we still did it. Rode our bicycles, you know, 8 miles to go watch, uh, watch a baseball game.

[00:07:38.970] - Robert Keller

Well, I would leave. We lived in a kind of semi-rural area, not super rural down there. Everything was acre and a quarter lots, kind of on dirt roads. I would leave and ride my bike from the acreage area up into what we called in town, which is kind of like a suburb. And it was the same thing, it was like 5 to 8 miles to go ride into town, right? And why I went, no particular reason. I had nothing better to do that day, right?

[00:08:07.890] - Big Rich Klein

So what kind of things interested you as a kid growing up?

[00:08:11.790] - Robert Keller

Um, when I was doing, like, later on, me and my dad got into racing electric remote control cars, off-road cars. Got into it pretty big. Uh, I won a state points championship one time. I was runner-up in Georgia for a four-wheel drive class up there, and we did that for a while, and I was kind of into it. Like, I worked on those cars all the time in the garage, and that's what I did all through middle school up until about the time I got ready to have a driver's license, about 14, 15. I started getting less interested in it and more interested into, you know, actual vehicles.

[00:08:54.090] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And, uh, what kind of student were you? Were you a good one, or were you one of those that looked out the window waiting to go do something else?

[00:09:04.230] - Robert Keller

I guess the best way to describe this is I was one of the kind of troublemaker smart kids. Like, I was in like, uh, more advanced classes. And then especially in high school, there was a group of us that all got stuck in the same classes, and we were kind of semi-troublemakers but in quote-unquote smart kid classes, if that makes sense, right? And that's kind of what I did and never really got in trouble per se, but got on the cusp of it a lot. I guess that's the best way to describe it. And also to help, my, my mother was also a school teacher too, so that kind of almost made things worse for me, I guess you'd say.

[00:09:50.170] - Big Rich Klein

At the same school? Yes. Oh wow.

[00:09:53.220] - Robert Keller

At my high school. Yeah. That would have— and I went to— and down there they had what they call the magnet program at the time. If you chose a certain, uh, I won't call career path or educational path, you could choose what high school you went to anywhere in the county if they offered that. And I ended up going to a different school, and she ended up being at the same school, and ended up making me dual— well, didn't make me, but I ended up dual enrolling into college while I was in high school at the same time. And I, I should have stuck with it, but I almost had an AA degree and I stopped like 2 credits short because I don't know, I got to where I didn't know what I was really doing.

[00:10:38.500] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Did you, did you play any sports or anything? I did not play any sports.

[00:10:44.450] - Robert Keller

Okay. I was not that interested in sports at all. The only thing I was semi-interested in during high school was we had an engineering class and we used to have auto shop. And by the time I could be in auto shop, so I was a freshman and they saw that auto shop, I think I could be a sophomore if you go into it. They ended the auto shop program at my school. Oh, wow. Yeah. Which might be in hindsight, it might have been a good thing because I had a feeling I probably would have been a worse student if I was in Auto shop.

[00:11:20.710] - Big Rich Klein

And did you, after high school, did you pursue any college?

[00:11:27.750] - Robert Keller

I did. I went ahead and went to the community college to try to finish up because I already had the credits from dual enrolling at the high school. And I went there to go ahead and try to get my AA, and I was doing okay. We call it the 13th grade. And, uh, I was doing okay, and then I failed an English class because I basically didn't show up. And then I went to go retake the English test, but this time I had a different instructor that was super strict, and I failed that class too. And then I got to the point where I just got frustrated with school and basically said I'm taking time off and never went back. Okay. And so I'm a college dropout.

[00:12:07.220] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, that's okay. So the— your parents as a family and stuff, did you guys— with your mom being a schoolteacher, that means she probably didn't work during the summer. Did you guys vacation? And if you did, what did, uh, what kind of things did you do?

[00:12:26.650] - Robert Keller

Things we did wasn't that much. For a little while, we used to do, uh, we used to go camping, but like RV-style camping, like travel trailers. We had a motorhome for a hot minute. Things like that. And we just all over the state, different places, but nothing like real, like I call real outdoorsy camping. Is more, you know, RV park camping, right? That's the kind of things we did.

[00:12:50.340] - Big Rich Klein

They made sure they had a pool or something for the kids?

[00:12:53.770] - Robert Keller

Yeah, that would probably cost too much money, so we didn't do that.

[00:12:57.570] - Big Rich Klein

Okay, just kind of better than a rest area alongside the highway, right?

[00:13:02.410] - Robert Keller

Yeah, you know, they probably had a, they probably had a, uh, you know, a bathhouse and, you know, a decent bathroom. But, you know, we went and saw stuff. Yeah. Okay.

[00:13:14.790] - Big Rich Klein

And, uh, did you travel outside of Florida much during—

[00:13:19.370] - Robert Keller

uh, we go, we'd go back to Missouri sometimes, occasionally, you know, and just visit, basically visit family and, you know, just stuff like that. Well, you know, more I think about now, every— I want to say for a little while there, every summer me and my dad would go back to Missouri and then we'd go car hunting for old cars. Oh, because he would buy old cars like, you know, '40s, '50s cars and then bring them to Florida and flip them. Because in Florida there's not a lot of '40s and '50s cars because the state really isn't that old. Right. The population in the state didn't, you know, jump up, you know, in the '40s, '50s. There wasn't a lot of people here. So for a little bit, every summer we'd go car hunting in Missouri and like Iowa and Kansas and bring one back and he'd sell it. And pretty sure his system was he'd sell that car for enough money that it paid for our trip to Missouri and back, you know, fuel and all that stuff.

[00:14:18.860] - Big Rich Klein

Okay, that makes sense.

[00:14:20.110] - Robert Keller

So, you know, free vacation where we were actually kind of half-ass working but having a good time finding oddball cars.

[00:14:26.780] - Big Rich Klein

And when you went to Missouri for these vacations with your dad, besides buying cars, did you know— do you have a bunch of cousins or something that you ran around with?

[00:14:35.450] - Robert Keller

Oh yeah, we had some— I had some cousins I'd go see, uh, we'd hang out with them. We'd go— well, we were way younger when we first moved to Florida and go back. I remember we'd just go meet my one cousins and their family and we'd go to Pizza Hut and that was our big deal, you know, with the pizza with our you know, pitchers of soda and the jukebox and our pan pizza, right?

[00:14:59.600] - Big Rich Klein

Any, uh, any arcade games back then?

[00:15:02.530] - Robert Keller

I'm sure, uh, you know, ironically you say that. So my grandparents on my mother's side, they actually had arcade games and pool tables and pinballs that they, you know, took to different locations and they split, you know, I forgot how that exactly worked, but they basically, whatever revenue came into that machine, they split with the, you know, the establishment that they were at. Okay. So summertime, if I spent summers up there with them, I could go into the barn out back that had all the machines in it, and they'd open the doors to it where I could just click the thing for the credits, and I played pinball and video games in the barn all day.

[00:15:48.730] - Big Rich Klein

Wow, did you become a pinball wizard?

[00:15:52.390] - Robert Keller

Um, funny you say that, is pinball still one of my favorite things to play if there's a pinball machine?

[00:15:57.880] - Big Rich Klein

Me too. And when I was in college, I got hooked on Asteroids.

[00:16:03.990] - Robert Keller

Yep, they had that, and they had jukeboxes too, like regular 45 jukeboxes. They had all that stuff. Most of their stuff was in, uh, private clubs, right? You know, like, uh, you know, private boat clubs or like an Elks or a Moose, things like that, was where most of the stuff went.

[00:16:21.500] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And, uh, what was the first car that you got to drive?

[00:16:32.140] - Robert Keller

The first one that really wasn't mine, but it was mine to drive, if that makes sense, was an '83 Chevy K10 Suburban with a 6.2 diesel. Oh, okay. My dad bought that for when we're racing RC cars. That's what we used to go to all the different races because we could fit everything in the back of it, and the old 6.2 would get almost 20 miles a gallon.

[00:16:55.680] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, because they didn't move down the road very fast. No.

[00:17:00.480] - Robert Keller

And also, you know, this is like, you know, early '90s. Diesel fuel wasn't very expensive in the early '90s either.

[00:17:05.710] - Big Rich Klein

No, because nobody used it.

[00:17:08.110] - Robert Keller

Nope. But that's what I first drove when I turned 16. I drove that. That's what I drove all the time.

[00:17:17.230] - Big Rich Klein

And, uh, was it a chick magnet?

[00:17:20.190] - Robert Keller

Oh, totally, because everybody wanted a rattling, clattering, you know, Suburban as their, you know, super badass vehicle they're gonna drive.

[00:17:31.250] - Big Rich Klein

But it— but you could put more people in it. It could, yes. And then being a K series, it was four-wheel drive.

[00:17:39.610] - Robert Keller

Yes, I just remember distinctly too, being it was diesel, has a huge tank. I could run for, I felt like, weeks at a time before I had to put fuel back in it.

[00:17:49.020] - Big Rich Klein

And then like you said, diesel was cheap. Yep, it was then. And, uh, what kind of— did you have like a group of guys or, you know, that you ran around with in, in school?

[00:18:03.480] - Robert Keller

Um, really, in school, no, because I went to a school— the high school I went to was like 3 towns over. It was quite a ways away. So everybody went to middle school with it, but the same people in high school— and most people at the high school didn't live where I lived, right?

[00:18:19.870] - Big Rich Klein

Because it was a magnet school.

[00:18:21.640] - Robert Keller

Yes. Okay. So most of the people I hung out with was actually people that ended up working at the auto parts store that I worked at. When I was in high school. Okay, and that's the people I ended up hanging out with.

[00:18:35.040] - Big Rich Klein

That's— that was going to be my next question. What was your— what's your job history like? What was your first job?

[00:18:41.310] - Robert Keller

Very first job, I worked at a feed store slinging hay bales and feed sacks for the first summer when I turned 16. And that was all well and good, but oh my gosh, it was hard work and it was hot. And then I got a job at an auto parts store, and that's what I did all through high school. And actually worked auto parts through college too.

[00:19:04.780] - Big Rich Klein

You were a bigger kid, tall, right?

[00:19:07.980] - Robert Keller

Uh, yeah, I was always like 6'1", 6'2", and in high school I weighed about 240. Okay, I'm surprised.

[00:19:18.830] - Big Rich Klein

Well, if you went to a magnet school, probably didn't have a football team.

[00:19:22.900] - Robert Keller

Oh yeah, I had a football team.

[00:19:24.120] - Big Rich Klein

Did they try to recruit you?

[00:19:25.950] - Robert Keller

They didn't, but the wrestling team did because Well, the problem was that they, they, the class I'd have to be in, I either had to put weight on, so muscle mass, or I was going to have to cut weight. And they really wanted me to cut weight to go in the class they wanted me to wrestle in. And our high school was like wrestling state champs for whatever size school, whatever age division it was, like multiple years in a row. Our high school was big into wrestling. Okay. But I just didn't want to put— I'll be honest, I just want to put the effort into it.

[00:20:00.940] - Big Rich Klein

Right, right. I can, I can understand that. Um, I, in high school, I swam long distance, um, and then, you know, the typical soccer and, and football, and then was asked to, to go out for wrestling. And I was like, well, what, what, what do you do for workouts? And the first thing the coach says, we run 7 miles a day. And I said, nope, not me. Yep.

[00:20:27.900] - Robert Keller

And they'd wear— they'd wear suits to make them sweat so they cut water weight to make weight. And I was like, yeah, this doesn't sound fun to me. No, it's grueling torture.

[00:20:38.780] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I, I, I— they were just— I, without any training, I was able to wrestle pretty well. And they were like, well, you know, you're gonna have to do this and this and this. And I'm like, well, you know, I I can wrestle against the guys that are, that you already have, and typically I can beat them. Why do I need to, why do I need to, to do all this extra work and cut weight or do anything else? You know, I'm, and they, the coach was like, oh no, you got to have this endurance and everything. And I'm like, well, not if I end the matches fast. So I never wrestled. Yep. Not, uh, Not in that way. Yeah. So then, um, what, what did you do after the, the auto parts store? How long were you there?

[00:21:35.750] - Robert Keller

Uh, well, I started doing auto parts when I was about between 16 and 17. I worked for— then it was uh, Discount Auto Parts then, which later became Advance. Now it's Advance Auto Parts, same place. I worked there until I was 18 or 19-ish. Then I went to an independent parts store because I felt like they were— and it's gonna sound weird, but they just— there's a bunch of things going on, and I felt like I was getting overworked for what I was doing, and I just walked out and quit. And then went to an independent parts store where I worked there when I was in college. And that job was great, and the people that worked there were fun to be around and everything else. It's a little independent place. There was 5 locations in the county, you know, ran by one guy, owned it. And every store you would think would be exactly the same, but they weren't. It depends on who the manager was, and our manager was pretty laid back. So we always had, we always had a ball there. We did some things that probably weren't legal. Nobody cared, you know.

[00:22:44.990] - Robert Keller

But I did that until I quit college. And talking about that manager, so I told that manager, I quit college, I need more hours, you know, can you give me more hours now that I quit college? For now, he wouldn't give me more hours, and I didn't understand why. And now looking back on, I know why he did, because he wanted to try to force me to basically do better than work at a parts store, I feel. Ah, like he wanted to give— like, basically be like, now you go back to school or find a legit career.

[00:23:20.370] - Big Rich Klein

And I really feel that's why he wouldn't give me more hours, because he wanted to make sure that you didn't just stick around and, and not achieve what you could. Yep.

[00:23:29.820] - Robert Keller

I think he didn't want to see me be a— nothing wrong with being a parts type part store counter guy at a local auto parts store. Nothing wrong with that, but I think he didn't want to see me be there, you know, from being age 18 to being, you know, 50 at the same place, never going anywhere, right? I think that's what that was about. So I left there, and my dad helped get me a job at a, a place called Holland Pump. Which was a dewatering pump place, which I guess the best way to explain it is they have— they had pump heads that ran off hydraulic power units, okay, that you would float in like a pond or a lake or canal so you could pump that down to do work in the pond, lake, or canal, like, you know, dredge work, excavation work, you know. That kind of stuff. This place built them, serviced them, rented them. And I actually, at the age of 19, they entrusted me enough to give me the keys to a service truck to go set up and pick up rental units and do basic maintenance on them at 19 years old.

[00:24:46.200] - Robert Keller

Wow. Which is kind of wild to think back now. Could you imagine now giving a 19-year-old the keys to a, to a four-wheel drive truck? And say, go at it, right? I don't think that would happen today. True. But that's why I did that. Worked my ass off and realized that, you know, I can do all right here, but working your butt off like this is going to be rough. And then after a while, a buddy I worked at the parts store, his dad worked for the phone company. He started working for the phone company. And then he told me, hey, you need to go call this place and go take some tests and see if you can work for the phone company. And well, the rest is history. I've been at the phone company, which we're not even a phone company anymore, for now 27 years.

[00:25:35.330] - Big Rich Klein

Wow. Yeah. And what company is that?

[00:25:40.820] - Robert Keller

Currently? Yeah. We are now AT&T. Okay. We used to be BellSouth, then SBC bought the AT&T name, and then we started buying everybody up and rebranded everything AT&T.

[00:25:56.330] - Big Rich Klein

Right. And I remember when, when Bell, they, they— I think it was federal government came in and just said, okay, you guys have to break this up. Yep.

[00:26:07.260] - Robert Keller

That's '84, 1984. Yep. They divided all the Bells up and they came all the baby Bells. And that's when it came Southern Bell, and then when I got hired on, it was called Bell South. Yes.

[00:26:21.130] - Big Rich Klein

And, uh, what is it— what did you start off doing at Bell South?

[00:26:26.870] - Robert Keller

Uh, I was actually got hired off the street as what they call a cable repairman, which is— was pretty unheard of. And still to this day, you tell people that and they look at you like you're crazy. You got hired off the street to do that job.

[00:26:39.920] - Big Rich Klein

And why is that? Is— was it the technical aspect of it?

[00:26:43.200] - Robert Keller

Uh, yes. And usually people that were there for years worked their way up to become a cable repairman.

[00:26:51.650] - Big Rich Klein

So, and I just— how did that happen? How did, how did that happen? Did you just test really well with them?

[00:26:57.700] - Robert Keller

I guess I tested good enough. Nice. So when you take tests there, then they had what they called an electronics test, and they had a electricity test, and then there's a general test. You have to take 3 different written tests, and you pass those tests— if you passed 2 of those tests, you then went to a physical test. But if you passed all 3, I guess that qualified you to be what they call a facility technician. And I passed all 3. Nice. And I got— yeah, and I got hired off the street as facility technician into doing cable repair.

[00:27:34.800] - Big Rich Klein

So you were the cable repairman?

[00:27:38.380] - Robert Keller

Yes.

[00:27:39.100] - Big Rich Klein

You know, they have characters in movies about those people.

[00:27:42.110] - Robert Keller

Yeah, yeah, they do. Different type of cable, but yes.

[00:27:50.640] - Big Rich Klein

So were you doing like commercial stuff or residential? All of it. All of it.

[00:27:58.830] - Robert Keller

Okay. So At that time, when I first got hired on, a cable repairman— so they had what they call the service tech. Service tech go out first, the guys that drove vans. They'd go out there and they'd try to fix whatever the problem was. If they couldn't fix the problem, it got turned over to cable. That's when we came out, because then the troubles— it's supposed to be when they turn it back, actually in the physical cable. You know, it's not in the house, it's not in the drop going to the house, it's in the physical cable and gets turned back to us. And we'd come out there and then go, go get into the cable and fix it. And we all drove either small bucket trucks or like 3/4-ton trucks with like service bodies on them instead of vans.

[00:28:43.130] - Big Rich Klein

And was it just like you in the truck, or did you have just one person?

[00:28:47.860] - Robert Keller

Just you? Yep, just one person. Okay. Yep.

[00:28:51.140] - Big Rich Klein

And how long were you as that service tech?

[00:28:54.660] - Robert Keller

Uh, a facility tech? Facility tech, yes. Well, technically I still am, but my job functions changed over the years. All right. So I was a cable repairman for the first 5 or 6 years, and then they put me— then I became an air pressure tech. Oh, and I was an air pressure tech for like ever until recently, like like 2 years ago.

[00:29:22.500] - Big Rich Klein

So explain what an airtech is.

[00:29:26.200] - Robert Keller

Uh, a lot of people don't know this, but old copper telephone cables that are in the underground and sometimes even direct buried and actually occasionally in the air, the copper is insulated with paper wrapped around the copper strands. And then the outer sheath is either going to be lead or it can be plastic. But the paper insulation, obviously, if it gets wet, makes it into one giant conductor instead of multiple conductors. So they actually have dry air that is pressurized in those cables to keep all the water out. Huh. And my job was to maintain all the dryers that were in the main offices and find and repair any leaks in the system to keep the cables dry.

[00:30:18.500] - Big Rich Klein

Interesting. Mm-hmm. Interesting. I didn't know that there was air in those cables.

[00:30:25.170] - Robert Keller

Yep, not all of them, but the ones in the underground, like in the manholes, almost all those will. And occasionally in the air— very now not at all, but back then occasionally— and occasionally direct buried.

[00:30:38.630] - Big Rich Klein

So you had to go down into the manholes, like in the streets and stuff? Yes. So not all those manholes are sewers, or are they running along with the sewers? Nope.

[00:30:51.890] - Robert Keller

Uh, a telecommunications manhole will only have telecommunication stuff in it. Okay. Generally, I say that generally. We had some in downtown West Palm that had the water main going through the middle of it. Okay.

[00:31:05.130] - Big Rich Klein

And, and those, those manholes, are they just like at junctions or something, or is it like—

[00:31:11.410] - Robert Keller

uh, they are just junctions with conduit between them. It's gonna be big. Normally it's a big concrete room that's underground, and there's conduit that runs from between them all. The really old ones are soft brick with dirt floors. Oh, nice. Yep. And also those really old ones, the conduit that runs between them are wood. They're wooden ducts between the manholes. Wow. For the really old stuff, I'm talking stuff that was put in the ground in the 1920s to like the 1940s.

[00:31:46.070] - Big Rich Klein

And we're still using those same lines?

[00:31:48.630] - Robert Keller

Uh, some places they are still using lines that old, yes.

[00:31:51.440] - Big Rich Klein

Wow. Okay, I would have figured by now everything was like you know, fiber optic type stuff.

[00:31:59.150] - Robert Keller

It's, it's getting there. So like AT&T, their goal is have all copper shut off by 2029. And right now as we speak, they're pulling copper out of the underground and reclaiming it. So they're basically scrapping it and getting scrap value for it.

[00:32:18.150] - Big Rich Klein

Kind of like crackheads do.

[00:32:20.340] - Robert Keller

Yes, they're trying to beat the crackheads and pulling it out. Okay, that makes sense. So I have heard through the grapevine there is places like up in the Atlanta area where there's people that are setting up on manholes in the middle of the night with all the equipment, with vests and the whole deal, looking like they're supposed to be there and going in and stealing the copper and leaving and taking it.

[00:32:46.290] - Big Rich Klein

Well, it's better than climbing those high-energy poles. Yeah, you know, and trying to get the—

[00:32:51.490] - Robert Keller

you know, the best way to not get caught is to look like you're doing what you're supposed to be doing, right?

[00:32:59.350] - Big Rich Klein

Yep, true enough. So I wonder how bank robbers do that. I don't know.

[00:33:10.710] - Robert Keller

They do it electronically now, and they just go in there and, uh, move things around in accounts.

[00:33:16.150] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, you're right, they do, don't they? Yep. So that's interesting about the, those underground vaults and you're in Florida and you get torrential rains, hurricanes. Do they flood or does your pump, your old pump experience come in handy to get into some of those vaults after those kind of storms?

[00:33:39.710] - Robert Keller

I don't know. They're almost always full of water all the way to the top. Anytime you gotta go in, you gotta pump it down.

[00:33:45.550] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. Yep. So that pump experience probably helps. Yeah, a little bit.

[00:33:50.860] - Robert Keller

Different style pump, but yep.

[00:33:52.460] - Big Rich Klein

Okay, so what is it called now, an Air Tech?

[00:33:56.840] - Robert Keller

I was an air pressure tech up until about 2 years ago, and now I'm back on the repair side again.

[00:34:02.950] - Big Rich Klein

All right, not by choice. Oh, not by choice. Okay. No. Did they just come to you one day and say, um, You're off of air and now you're, uh, repair?

[00:34:15.240] - Robert Keller

Basically, yes. That's basically how that went.

[00:34:20.080] - Big Rich Klein

And they said take it or else?

[00:34:21.850] - Robert Keller

That's pretty much how that goes. And the real irony of this is that all the years of doing air pressure, I finally got a brand new truck that was made just to do that type of work. And, uh, then literally 2 weeks later they told me after I get the truck Oh yeah, you're not gonna be doing air pressure anymore. Oh sweet, I got this cool underground truck that I'm not gonna use. Oh, that's a bitch. Yeah, welcome to corporate America where nothing makes sense.

[00:34:51.940] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I bailed on corporate America in 2000. I just, I couldn't deal with it anymore, and that's when I started putting on the rock crawls. Yeah.

[00:35:04.190] - Robert Keller

I wish I could tell you I have a good exit strategy, but I don't, right?

[00:35:09.460] - Big Rich Klein

Except you're not— so now are you— when you're in repair, so you're not down in the, in the, the trenches anymore?

[00:35:18.950] - Robert Keller

No, I'm not going to manholes anymore. Now I'm doing basic repairs, going to residents and houses and stuff. But now instead of phones, it's almost— it's generally always internet now that we're fixing. I mean, there is still some landlines out there that people are going, and I'm still going out and fixing them, but most of it's all internet, and it's only turning to fiber, and they still haven't got me any fiber equipment, so I can't even do fiber.

[00:35:45.140] - Big Rich Klein

Wow. Yeah, we got my mom off of the, the landline. She still has the number, but it's ported it over to it. Yeah, it's all done off of a— I don't know what it is. I guess it's off of the, the internet now.

[00:36:04.990] - Robert Keller

Is it a little tower inside our house that you can plug a regular phone into?

[00:36:09.160] - Big Rich Klein

You know, that's a good question. I know it doesn't plug into the, the old AT&T line.

[00:36:14.730] - Robert Keller

Yeah, because it could either be— they could have either went to VoIP where you can put— goes over the internet, or now it's Well, AT&T's pushing a thing they call Advanced Phone, and it basically works off the cell phone towers, but you can plug a regular old house phone into it, or you can backfeed the whole house, and it acts like a normal phone. You pick it up, you get dial tone, and you dial your number.

[00:36:39.660] - Big Rich Klein

That's what it is. Yep, that's what she's got. Huh, interesting. And what kind of vacation time do you get with a job like this since you've been with, with AT&T for so long?

[00:36:58.050] - Robert Keller

Well, quite a bit. And that's also why sometimes I feel like I'm semi-trapped where I'm at. I get almost 7 weeks of paid time off a year. And I also have unlimited sick time, which is very weird to explain to people how that works, but I have that also. Unlimited sick? Yeah, after you're there for 25 years, you get unlimited sick pay. However, the caveat to that is you're only supposed to have so many incidents per year. Otherwise they start getting a little funny and went and— yeah.

[00:37:34.950] - Big Rich Klein

So you couldn't just claim like one long sickness?

[00:37:40.280] - Robert Keller

No, so anything past 5 days goes from short-term to long-term disability, and then it turns— it opens up a whole can of worms you don't want to open up.

[00:37:49.390] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, okay, I get it.

[00:37:50.770] - Robert Keller

Yeah, yep.

[00:37:54.550] - Big Rich Klein

So when did you get into off-road?

[00:37:58.500] - Robert Keller

Well, technically, I guess you could say I got into off-road about About '98, '99. Okay. And when I started screwing around with off-road, uh, well, yeah, it'd be '99 because I started the phone company and the other Robert worked there and he was already screwing around with mud trucks. And I started screwing around with mud trucks because, well, we were in South Florida and all we had was water. And mud. And, uh, I think the first thing I messed with was my dad acquired a '66 Chevy Suburban that was a factory four-wheel drive with a 292 and a four-speed. And now looking back at it, it was a super rare truck, and we were just beating the snot out of it.

[00:38:55.620] - Big Rich Klein

If we only knew. Yes.

[00:38:59.240] - Robert Keller

But it's a factory 4-wheel drive Suburban, the '66. Yeah. And, and I'm—

[00:39:06.220] - Big Rich Klein

you, you, you mentioned the other Robert.

[00:39:09.850] - Robert Keller

Yeah, so I started the phone company, and like a month later, another Robert started the phone company, and we were in the exact same crew. Okay, so we became Robert 1 and Robert 2, and for some reason we always worked together. Our boss just put us together working all the time.

[00:39:30.820] - Big Rich Klein

That's so he could just say, hey Robert, and you both would turn around.

[00:39:33.560] - Robert Keller

Yeah, we were Robert 1 and Robert 2. He had us do all kinds of these little weird pet projects. He had us actually hanging cable and cutting cable over that other repairmen wouldn't do. He had us doing that. And we— oh, we had cell phones. We were the only repairman with cell phones at the time in our crew. There were bricks, you know, the old bricks. Yeah, yep. Because he would send me and Robert to a super rural area out, out west, out near Belgrade, where the girl with sugarcane, right? He'd send us out there all the time. He goes, that's the only way I can get a hold of y'all, or you can get a hold of anybody else too, for that matter. Because back in that time, if you had to call anybody, you had to take what you call your butt set, go find a terminal or cross box somewhere, and you found somebody's dial tone, you just clipped on it and you used it and called somebody.

[00:40:27.160] - Big Rich Klein

And in the old days, didn't— would they get charged for that then?

[00:40:31.410] - Robert Keller

I had no idea. Huh. I assume— I assume it's a local call, they wouldn't.

[00:40:36.250] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I guess so.

[00:40:36.890] - Robert Keller

Yeah, yeah, it's a local call, they would not. But that's the only way you could get a hold of anybody. So then, back then, everybody had a pager. So all you had was a pager that would page you basically to call your boss or call load control, and you had to go find dial tone somewhere and use their dial tone and call them, huh? You know, pre-cell phone, which sounds bizarre to say, but that's kind of the way it was.

[00:40:58.430] - Big Rich Klein

I remember the early days of pagers. Either it was either like you were in construction or you were a drug dealer.

[00:41:09.870] - Robert Keller

Well, you want to go a little bit farther back on that? When I worked the pump company, we had Nextel radios. Oh, okay. But they would never turn the phone feature on for us, for any of the field techs. So we could only radio in to the main unit, you know, at the shop. We couldn't— which stunk because you'd go on a job site and you'd have to radio into the office for them to then call the customer on the phone, and they'd play this big game of, you know, three-way communication trying to figure out where you're supposed to be on this job site.

[00:41:49.080] - Big Rich Klein

Let's, uh, let's streamline things, right? Yeah, yeah. So then, um, with you and the other Robert, um, both into mud trucks, um, and that was— you, you were using that '66 Suburban?

[00:42:07.070] - Robert Keller

I was for a little while. Okay. And then I acquired an '82 Chevy K10 Stepside that was already on 38-inch Groundhogs, if any of the younger people know what Groundhogs are anymore. And that was the truck I used for a long time too. It, it was horrible. The only piece of glass in it was the windshield, and it was so rusty when you came to the end of a rope, the rust would fall in your eyes. It was a real piece of work. You started with a screwdriver.

[00:42:40.480] - Big Rich Klein

Did you leave the screwdriver in it, or— I did.

[00:42:43.540] - Robert Keller

So you know how the Chevys have like the, the plastic slash foam dash, right? It was a stubby screwdriver. I just shoved it in the dash. Classic. Oh yeah, it's a quality piece of equipment.

[00:42:59.920] - Big Rich Klein

So is that why you're still a Chevy guy?

[00:43:03.030] - Robert Keller

I don't know how that happened, but yeah. Because after that one, I bought a Blazer, but actually a Jimmy, full-size Jimmy. All right, after that piece of crap truck, I bought a full-size Jimmy because I wanted something nicer, and I built it. And that's about the time I was really getting out of the water and the mud because I was getting tired of doing wheel bearings and changing axle oil, like, you know, weekly, it felt like. So I started building it more trail-oriented, even though I still ran water down there. And my end goal for that one in my mind was to go to Teleco with it. Now, I never made it to Teleco, but knowing what I know now about Teleco, I was vastly unprepared in that truck to go to Teleco.

[00:43:56.270] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. Was it all open-open then?

[00:44:00.900] - Robert Keller

No, it actually— it was locked. Oh wow, okay. Yeah, it was— had a Ford 9-inch in the back with a Detroit in it and 488s and Moser axle shafts. And the front though was, was a 10-bolt with a, uh, I forgot what kind of— it's lunchbox locker sorts with stock axle shafts. And I had it on 38— at the end I had it on 38x15 wide Boggers. And I could snap the ears on the front axle shafts on command if I wanted to.

[00:44:33.930] - Big Rich Klein

So you learned throttle control?

[00:44:36.470] - Robert Keller

Yes, you had to, right? But it was vastly unprepared for what I thought I wanted to do. But I came up to Cala National Forest with it a lot and ran trails up here. That was even in— that was the early 2000s I was doing that. Okay. Actually, wait a minute, I skipped a truck. I bought that after I bought— oh wait a minute, I skipped, I skipped the truck in the sequence. Oh, oh yeah. So I have a good job now, right? Make big money in my head. I bought myself a brand new 2001 Dodge Ram 1500 short bed regular cab, and it was re-geared and lifted within the first 3,000 miles.

[00:45:19.350] - Big Rich Klein

Voiding the warranty.

[00:45:21.460] - Robert Keller

Yeah, well, funny, I just had a conversation of the day with, um, with Melvin about this, talking about the dealer I bought that from. The dealer I bought that truck from was really cool, and the small dealer, they didn't care. They warrantied stuff on it all the time. They even replaced the front axle seal on it when it was in there for something else under warranty, and we caused the axle leak because we had it all apart and regeared it, but they They even fixed that. Wow. They didn't care.

[00:45:50.620] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, because they just write it— they just write it to the warranty and get it— get paid for it anyway.

[00:45:56.970] - Robert Keller

Yep. Yeah, exactly. You know, back in the day when small town dealer just was like, hey, whatever, we're gonna get paid for it. Yes, they do warranty work on it all the time, but I had to go all the way to Lewiston to do that, that they would do it.

[00:46:09.500] - Big Rich Klein

And Did you, did you get rid of that truck and then get the full-size Jimmy?

[00:46:17.630] - Robert Keller

No, I got the full-size Jimmy after I realized I probably should stop beating on my daily driver so hard. Okay, got the full-size Jimmy and built it, and I would— well, I was always crazy. Like, I drove that thing on 38 boggers from, from Palm Beach County up to the north end of the Ocala National Forest about twice a year. Wow, this is real smart, but that is about a, about a 4-hour ride on buggers on the highway.

[00:46:50.440] - Big Rich Klein

So you were going through sets of buggers pretty quick.

[00:46:55.540] - Robert Keller

Ah, uh, if I— after 2 trips like that, they would kill— they would kill them after about a year and a half. I'd have to put new tires on it. Okay. Yep, I didn't drive it every day, but yeah, it was hard on it.

[00:47:09.270] - Big Rich Klein

Did you ever, um, oh my God, what was the name of those, those Swampert, those Intercos that had the big tread plates, um, big tread blocks? Oh, Thornbirds. Yeah, Thornbirds. Did you ever run Thornbirds?

[00:47:25.230] - Robert Keller

Oh no, no, no, they were a joke back then too. Yeah.

[00:47:29.050] - Big Rich Klein

I used to sell those and it was like, you really don't want these. Yeah, I do. I really do. No, you don't. You don't want these. No, no. And, uh, so when did you go from trails to more rocks?

[00:47:51.160] - Robert Keller

Well, that probably happened Well, I'm gonna have to go, go back here, so some more stories here. Okay, so I moved to Central Florida where I am now, which is just outside of— I'd say outside Daytona Beach because everybody knows where Daytona's at, right? I'm on the south end of the Ocala National Forest, southeast corner of it, where I live is like right here. I came up here, moved up here, had that truck. Ran the forest a little bit. And at that time, I don't remember the exact dates this happened in the forest, but at one time the, the rules were in the forest, any existing trail was a legal trail in the forest as long as you weren't creating a new trail. That's, that was the rules then. So if it was open and it was there, it was good. In about, I don't know what year, 2007, 2008 maybe, they changed that and they basically closed all the trails down the entire forest except for the main roads until they could remap the entire forest and number all the freaking trails. And then it turned into then you can only be on an existing numbered trail.

[00:49:08.840] - Robert Keller

But that little time period in there, they closed so much down, there was nothing to ride and nothing entertaining. So I actually got out of full-size four-wheel drives for a while, sold the Jimmy, got four-wheelers, started riding four-wheelers and going back to riding mud and water like a dummy, and then realizing how much maintenance was involved and got tired of that. And then we get back into full-size four-wheel drives when I got a '96 XJ from, at that time, my, uh, father-in-law at the time. I bought a '96— actually, I traded him a trailer for it, a '96 XJ, and started going riding the forest again because the forest was kind of open again because by then it was all remapped and you know where you could legally be. Okay, so now we're there, did that for a while, realized the XJ— I was either going to have to put a lot into it to get where I wanted it to be or I need to move on. And I got the YJ, which ironically I have again now. And I got it, and then I slowly built it up, and that's when I started getting the more serious things, I guess you could call it, with it.

[00:50:21.550] - Robert Keller

Okay. And then I got invited in 2014 on an adventure-style trip out of the blue, off the internet, off the old Facebook. And that kind of changed everything for me. Which adventure trip was that? Well, this was a group, they went by FAR. It was the Florida Adventure Rigs, is what it went by. It was started by a gay guy by the name of Mike Morero, and he actually was on the UA one year himself. Okay, he put together a group down here and they were doing it and they invited me out of the blue. And I found out I was the first one they decided to invite out of the blue to see how it was to invite a total stranger on their trip. And I went on that trip and that was in Virginia and West Virginia in my YJ on— it was on 38 Swampers because I still was tall and, you know, had mud on my mind for some stupid reason, even though I avoided it. And I, and I did that trip, week-long trip, and that's when I really figured out I like doing things that actually have some difficulty involved and, you know, some rocks and, you know, things that weren't just flat roads or a little washout here and there.

[00:51:46.980] - Robert Keller

And that's when I started getting into that. I came back from that trip, decided that the YJ didn't really have enough room in it to really pack how I thought I needed to pack, but I've learned a lot since then. And I built my GMC, my square body truck, to apply for the UA. And then I applied for it and got accepted, and I built the truck in 6 months and got accepted to go to UA in 2015.

[00:52:14.450] - Big Rich Klein

And, um, where was— where did that— where did that— you— I, I'm not familiar with where the each year where they go. Uh, I know all those guys, but I, I don't—

[00:52:26.300] - Robert Keller

I haven't followed them. Yeah, 2015 we were in Ohio, Kentucky, Tennessee, Georgia, and Alabama. I think those are the states we all touched. Yeah. Those are all states we all touched. That's the year we did that. And, uh, yeah, I, I couldn't believe that I got invited to go with basically a stock, you know, 1-ton square body truck on 40s. And, uh, went on that trip and that changed it for me all again. After I already did a week-long trip, figured out this is what I like to do, did the UA. So that's what I like to go do. And I still continue to go on the far trips with all the Florida guys. And, uh, yeah, I think I feel like I'm rambling now about what I was doing.

[00:53:19.130] - Big Rich Klein

No, not at all. So tell me about that UA trip, because like I said, I know almost everybody, especially the, the cronies.

[00:53:30.330] - Robert Keller

Yep, all those guys and Trent and now Christian, right? Uh, that, that year it was still a payway trip. 2015, it was the last payway trip actually. Was 2015, and, uh, had my buddy Jerry, which I met through the FAR group. He was my co-driver. We drove my truck all the way from here in Central Florida all the way to Ohio in my truck, and, uh, we started a place called Powerline Park in Ohio. Big muddy freaking— just muddy ass place with hill climbs, and it rained. Oh, let me tell you, the whole theme of 2015 is it rained. It rained. Yes. Funny part about that is me and Jerry, for some reason, bought rubber boots. Didn't think much of it. We were the only people with rubber boots. We're also the only people with dry feet the entire week.

[00:54:32.680] - Big Rich Klein

How much carnage was there on that trip?

[00:54:35.730] - Robert Keller

For me, not a lot. Um, what— I broke one— well, I didn't actually break the hub, I broke an engagement spring on one hub, but really that was it. I caved a door in, but nothing like— I didn't like break anything on the truck. I was driving super conservatively because the first time you're on UA, you don't know what they expected you or what you should be expecting. And I was being super conservative, and I was actually wheeling stuff harder than I really ever wheeled before also on top of that. So I was being super conservative, and I survived the week. That's all I was trying to do, and I, and I made it. But it literally rained every day except for the day that we used the canoes. We hold— oh, we hold canoes that year too. Everybody had a canoe on their truck. In, uh, Kentucky, outside of Harlan, we had canoe races, and that's the only time it didn't rain was during the canoe race. But you imagine we also got wet during the canoe race, right?

[00:55:43.550] - Big Rich Klein

So you were always— yeah, yeah, yes. Unbelievable. Yep. So what were those trips like? Hanging out with all those guys? I mean, because I'm sure you were, you know, addicted to the magazines and, you know, all of a sudden you get to see, you know, your media heroes basically, right?

[00:56:08.280] - Robert Keller

Yes. Well, the first year— well, so I, I was returning reader the next year. How, I don't know. But first year, 2015, you don't know— as far as me anyway, I didn't know how to really talk to anybody, or, you know, do I act a fool? Do I just sit here in the corner? Like, you don't know how to talk to these people. I know, like, you're— I don't call you starstruck, but you're just like, you know, how do you approach him and how do you talk to him and not sound like a moron when you're talking to him, right? So I just kind of stayed held back, you know, over and talk to people. And of course, as the week goes on, you learn everybody's little, like, you know, how they are and how they interact by observing them and stuff. And you get better at talking to people. And some people you get— become real good friends with. Some of them you're like, okay, I still don't really quite understand how to talk to you. And, you know, that's kind of how that worked. But when I came back in 2016, it was a completely different experience because now you show up, it's like all your old buddies, right?

[00:57:12.040] - Robert Keller

And now it's just talking to everybody and having a good old time. And the best thing I could— I've tried to do on 2016 is all the other invited readers that were there, I tried my best to figure out how to talk to them and like bring them with me as I was talking to somebody and bring them up to somebody to try to get them like, hey, just, just normal people, man. It's okay. Because you figure out that they're just normal people just like you are. They like doing the same things you do. It's just they happen to have been in a magazine article, right? But other than that, they're, they're, they're just like you are. There's no difference to them. They like doing the same things. They get up in the morning and put their pants on just like you do.

[00:57:55.320] - Big Rich Klein

Yep, one leg at a time. Yep. I've seen people try to put their pants on two legs, you know, you know, jump up and do it. It doesn't work.

[00:58:03.180] - Robert Keller

Yeah, no, well, if you could do that, probably pretty good at a sack race.

[00:58:07.280] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, that's true. So who on the, who on the trip did you have the most difficulty talking to that first year? First year?

[00:58:22.700] - Robert Keller

Mm. First year, actually, I have to say, it was probably gonna be Chris Durham. Because I didn't know how to take Chris Durham because he always felt like he was unapproachable when he was walking or doing something. I don't know how to explain that without making Chris sound like he's like—

[00:58:44.980] - Big Rich Klein

I don't know, it just—

[00:58:48.280] - Robert Keller

I couldn't tell. It's like, is he— does he not like me? I don't know. Right. I'd say that's it. Like, that was— he's probably up there in that department on that one.

[00:59:00.860] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, Chris is— I consider one of my, one of my favorite— he's my favorite rock crawler of all time. Um, I know there's— there might be some people that say, what, it wasn't me? But Chris was always just— for— we had a— we, we just hit it off for some reason. I don't know why, but, uh, maybe because I had a lot of friends that were that people thought were unapproachable as well. Yeah, you know, and, uh, it— I've got one friend that everybody goes, boy, he actually talks to you. And I said, yes, I don't get it, but he does.

[00:59:40.720] - Robert Keller

Well, see, now, like, now me and Chris, we talk, no big deal. Like, second year was way better. And then later on, I've ran into other places too, and now, like, we talking BS and do whatever now. Yeah, yeah. He has— evidently he's got a friend that he claims is an exact doppelgänger of me, and he has other people back it up, said, yes, he looks just like you and even sounds like you when you talk. I'm like, that's weird. And I can't remember who the guy— what the guy's name is, but he's sent pictures of him before where he's been to dinner with him. Good. That does kind of look like me.

[01:00:13.090] - Big Rich Klein

That's always weird. I get— yeah, every once in a while I'll get pictures or somebody will post something, goes 'Rich, is this you?' And it's typically in some meme or something now, you know. Yeah, it's like, 'No, that's not me. I've never done that.' So how did you guys come up with doing Adventure Wheelers East?

[01:00:37.830] - Robert Keller

Okay, without being— without sounding sour about something So the old FAR group, I was still doing things with them. Everything was good. And we went on a trip in Texas and I don't know how to explain with this. It just didn't feel the same anymore. You know, I just— something about it just did not feel the same. And I was like, I think I'm just going to go and start doing my own thing. And that's how it came about. I don't even remember what year that was now. Well, it might have been— what year did you go with us when we went to Tennessee and all that now?

[01:01:21.870] - Big Rich Klein

Oh my God, it was like 2022 or 2023. Yeah, one of those.

[01:01:27.670] - Robert Keller

Yeah. So whatever it is, we went, and I think that was our first inaugural trip, and I just decided, you know what, I'm gonna do my own thing. And well, I say my own thing, but also, so Jack Sloan, they were doing what they called the AA trips. It was Appalachian Adventures. They were doing their own trips. They always kind of stayed always like in West Virginia, Virginia, you know, Kentucky, up in there mostly. And we decided, you know what, let's take some people from this group and your group, and we just kind of made a super group, if that makes sense, right? And that's how it kind of came all about. And I, I'm pretty sure the trip you went on was our first trip that we did as AWE. Okay.

[01:02:18.430] - Big Rich Klein

You know, when you said that, that first trip you went there and you didn't know how to approach people, I felt that way on that AWE trip. And I might Go ahead.

[01:02:30.400] - Robert Keller

And I can understand that.

[01:02:32.070] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I'm normally not very shy, and I wasn't shy, but I was just watching the dynamics between everybody because obviously everybody, or most everybody, knew each other or were friends with other people that were on the trip, where I was just the guy that came in cold.

[01:02:51.480] - Robert Keller

Oh yeah, and I know what that's like because I did it— well, I did it on my first far trip, and I did it on my first UA, and it's just Yeah, you're like, okay. And I'm kind of an introvert to begin with, even though it probably doesn't sound like it because I'll keep talking and rambling. But I'm a, I'm a bit of an introvert, and I always feel like I'm super awkward when I try to talk to people. So a lot of times I don't in public. And then I can understand that, how you could, you would feel that way also.

[01:03:19.070] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, stepping into something new. Typically I'm not, I mean, I, I like to observe and then I jump in and I thought I assimilated pretty good by the end of that trip. Yeah. But I was cautious driving because my Jeep was at that point was, well, after that, the rear end went out on the way home. I mean, I got it to the trailer. Perfect timing. Yeah. It made, it was making so much noise.

[01:03:52.390] - Robert Keller

Did it have— what, what rear end was in that thing? Um, was it a '44? Yeah, '44.

[01:03:58.980] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, it had been a Curry, but, um, we had taken the center section because there was a mistake in putting in the 30-gallon fuel cell, um, Genrite cell in there. The guy that put it in, um, instead of adjusting the, the, the tank and where it sat when it compressed and it was rubbing. What he did is on the, the curry house cover, he just ground the COVID down and then painted it, and it was still under full compression, it would rub, and eventually it rubbed a hole in it, and we were leaving Moab and heading to Cedar City. And instead of loading the Jeep, my wife was driving it and we didn't even get up to the top of the pass coming out of Green River and the rear end seized.

[01:04:56.940] - Robert Keller

It slung all the oil out of it, didn't it? Yep, sure did.

[01:05:00.760] - Big Rich Klein

And so then we, you know, we found out what the problem was. It was just a small hole. I mean, you couldn't even put a pencil eraser in it. But it was a hole and it slung it out and seized the rear end. And then so we found a, we were able to salvage that center section, but not really. And so then we cut, I ended up cutting it out and we put in a 44 out of a Blazer or a Chevy truck or something out of it. That we put in instead. So that's what it had, but it was, it was, it was a good, you know, it's a good wheeler. I mean, it never ever hardly ever breaks down, but you know, I never break anything on it. If I do, it's something catastrophic like, you know, yeah, the rear end or blowing the motor. But it's gone now. I don't even own it anymore.

[01:06:01.340] - Robert Keller

Oh, no more, uh, old— what you call it— wood stove.

[01:06:04.550] - Big Rich Klein

Uh, yeah, the old wood stove. Yep. Nope, we, uh, I sold it. And, uh, the V8 XJ is actually streetable. When I get home, I put the winch bumper on it and the winch, and then it'll be trail— be ready to go break in on the trail. Oh, perfect. So I'm looking forward to that. Finally, after an 8-year project. Well, it's because I never had the time to do the work myself, so I was taking it into shops or businesses, that kind of stuff.

[01:06:37.570] - Robert Keller

And the worst part about 8-year project is lots of things have changed in technology and style in 8 years.

[01:06:44.310] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, but you know, 4-links are still 4-links, so yeah. And there's things I look at now that I'm going to change, you know. I got coils and shocks, and I'm going to go to coilovers. Yeah, but that's not that big of a, of a change. So, so what's next for you?

[01:07:06.940] - Robert Keller

That's a good question. I, I don't know. I guess I need to maintain all my, uh, all my vehicles. What I probably need to do—

[01:07:15.990] - Big Rich Klein

that's short term. Yeah.

[01:07:21.740] - Robert Keller

I don't know, I'm probably just— I just could keep doing my little week-long trips every year. And I think I'm— I thought about the other day and I said something to, uh, Jack about this ago. I'm looking back at what I, what I was doing, and I think I'm getting ready to make the Toyota a trailer queen again and start doing more long weekends at off-road parks in the Southeast like I used to do. Because I haven't done that in a while. Me and my son used to go at least 2 or 3 times a year and do like a long weekend. And I mean, he's 18 now, but I'm still, you know, looking and going, well, I haven't done that at all. So that might be where I'm going next, is going back trailer queening and off-road parking. Yep.

[01:08:10.700] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. So, uh, and yeah, go ahead.

[01:08:15.380] - Robert Keller

And maybe a little more, uh, I'd like a lot of things I would like to do, but I don't know if I'm gonna get around to it. I'd like to do a little more— I don't like the word overlanding, but, uh, more light trail riding with camping, I'll call it.

[01:08:32.670] - Big Rich Klein

You know, overlanding is a total lifestyle. Yes. You know, you got to have all the things. Yeah, I'm more of a minimal—

[01:08:41.760] - Robert Keller

a minimalist. Yes, I, I have hardly any of the things. And you know what, sometimes it's a lot easier to have hardly any of the things.

[01:08:50.260] - Big Rich Klein

I tried the overlanding thing for a while with my adventure trailer and the rooftop tent on it and made a shower, you know, and all that kind of stuff, and took it on the Rebel Rally with me a couple of times and you know, doing the whole route and everything. And, uh, and then I got to the point where I was like, no. And we bought a— we bought a Black Series, um, HQ15. So we got a bed and a bathroom and an indoor and outdoor kitchen, all in 15 feet.

[01:09:27.390] - Robert Keller

Nice. Yeah, see, that's where I— I have a sliding truck camper for my 3/4-ton truck. There's some things I would really like to be— take the time to do is just put that in there and just go out west and just look at stuff, you know, just not even anything hard, just dirt roads and just go see things I haven't been able to go see yet. There's lots. That's on me. Yep. And that's on my long-term things I want to do, but we'll see if I get it pulled off.

[01:09:58.250] - Big Rich Klein

So how is your wife with, uh camping?

[01:10:02.660] - Robert Keller

And she is good for— I'm sorry, like, if we're doing legit primitive camping, one night of legit primitive camping. Uh, if we can go someplace that has a bathhouse, she's good for, you know, 2 or 3 nights. It don't bother her. But like legit primitive, about one night of it. But most of our trips that we even do at AWE, true primitive camping, maybe one night out of the five, five out of the four nights that were, you know, actually on the trip, right? So this is not too bad. More she would have like this last trip that I went, I took the YJ and I took it with no, with just a bikini top on it, and I knew she would not like that trip. As far as that, because I got rained on and everything else. Not like you wouldn't enjoy this.

[01:11:00.370] - Big Rich Klein

That's why— that's one of the reasons I like XJs. Yeah, yeah.

[01:11:06.230] - Robert Keller

I will admit though, I didn't— I, I enjoyed it with just the bikini top on. It's just a better experience as far as being able to see things and just— I don't know, right? It just feels different than being like enclosed. Think, but it's also impractical at the same time.

[01:11:23.390] - Big Rich Klein

True, especially if you have a lady with you. Yes, my wife does not want me to take the hardtop off of her TJ.

[01:11:34.090] - Robert Keller

Oh man.

[01:11:35.130] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I haven't even had the doors off yet. Of course, it's only got 31— I just upgraded to 31-inch tires. Whoa, that's not getting too crazy. Yeah, no, it's bone stock. And I said, you know, I can get this built, um, I know people. And she goes, no, you're not touching this one.

[01:11:52.990] - Robert Keller

Well, the real truth, you and me both know, if you put one locker in that thing on 31s, it would go a lot of places with careful driving.

[01:12:01.750] - Big Rich Klein

Yes, that's what I started wheeling the Rubicon with. Mm-hmm. So, uh, What's the next— oh no, you guys, you guys just did your AWE trip.

[01:12:14.290] - Robert Keller

Yeah, yep. The next one's going to be— well, it's gonna be next year obviously, but I think it might be in the spring instead of the summer. Oh, interesting. Yep. I think mainly for temperature reasons because it's going to be— not to be a big spoiler here, I mean, everybody on the group already kind of knows it was on this last trip. It's going to be, I believe, Tennessee and Alabama. Okay. So, you know, Tennessee and Alabama in the middle of the summer is a bit warm and humid. Yes, absolutely. So it might end up being in the spring. Okay. So we just get rained on every day instead.

[01:12:55.430] - Big Rich Klein

There you go. Just make sure you have that bikini top. Yeah. Exactly.

[01:13:04.820] - Robert Keller

I do have another trip coming up. I think, I think I'm going on, uh, Ken Smith's Old School Ride in November, I think, in the YJ. Nice.

[01:13:14.910] - Big Rich Klein

So I do have that coming up.

[01:13:17.840] - Robert Keller

Yeah, Ken's a good guy. Oh yeah.

[01:13:20.160] - Big Rich Klein

Have you ever interviewed Kenny before? Um, no, I haven't gotten him on, on the podcast. Podcast. Okay. He's on my list. Okay, cool. But I've got quite a few names on the list and it seems like every week I add somebody.

[01:13:35.210] - Robert Keller

So, I mean, I beat Kenny on the list. Yes, I'll have to rub that into him. You know, just like if you make it— just like if you make an obstacle that he somehow didn't make, you have to rub that into him the rest of the week. Like, no, no kidding. That one obstacle that you didn't make this entire week that I did.

[01:13:59.780] - Big Rich Klein

There you go. Well, Robert, I want to say thank you so much for, for coming on and being a guest on Conversations with Big Rich, and I really appreciate it, and I appreciate your friendship. I wish we got to hang out more. I was trying to get to Moab, but to see you, but I didn't even get in until like midday Friday.

[01:14:21.230] - Robert Keller

Yeah, we left Thursday morning, I think. I left out of there because I was having truck issues and everything else. I was just trying to get home without my truck not quitting, right? I get it.

[01:14:34.060] - Big Rich Klein

So, well, yeah, I think, I think right Thursday. Well, thank you so much for coming on and sharing your life. And, uh, you know, I, uh, I hope to make another one of your AWE trips. That was— I had fun with you guys.

[01:14:50.910] - Robert Keller

Oh, I hope you do make it out. They're always, they're always fun. Like, we tell people that might just— that might necessarily be the hardest wheeling you've ever done, but it's going to be fun.

[01:14:59.760] - Big Rich Klein

Well, you guys will have to include Texas now because I've got two parks that I oversee in Texas.

[01:15:05.090] - Robert Keller

Um, I think— let's see, 2027. I think 2028 might be in Texas, I think.

[01:15:16.650] - Big Rich Klein

Well, I got two parks for you guys. Barnwell, which is You know, very well known. And then, uh, you know, it's trees, it's, it's more of an eastern park. And then we have Escondido Draw, which is, it's like, I've been there before.

[01:15:32.200] - Robert Keller

Yeah. Yep, I've been there. Cool. I was actually there on a UA.

[01:15:36.290] - Big Rich Klein

Ah, yes, with Trent. Yep, yep.

[01:15:40.540] - Robert Keller

I was a co-driver that year. Uh, Dave Hamrick was, went on, and I was his co-driver that year.

[01:15:46.730] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, well, we got a lot more trails open now. Oh, sweet. And campgrounds and all that kind of stuff. Cool. Awesome. All right, well, Robert, thank you so much, and, uh, I'll let you know when this airs.

[01:16:00.830] - Robert Keller

All righty, thank you, sir.

[01:16:02.190] - Big Rich Klein

All right, you take care. Thank you. All right, bye-bye. Well, that's another episode of Conversations with Big Rich. I'd like to thank you all for listening. If you could do us a favor and leave us a review on any podcast service that you happen to be listening on, or send us an email or text message or Facebook message and let me know any ideas that you have, or if there's anybody that you have that you think would be a great guest, please forward the contact information to me so that we can try to get them on. And always remember, live life to the fullest. Enjoying life is a must. Follow your dreams and live life with all the gusto you can. Thank you.